Dating and Relationships – Are Most Black Men Sociopaths?

| 10/19/2011 | Comments (39)

There was a guy I used to have the most interesting discussions with last year about gender, society, men and women (we’ll call him “Malik” for the sake of this article). “Malik” and I didn’t always agree, but the conversations were always interesting.

In one, we were discussing how many men cheat on their woman (even having children with other females while married), and manipulate women with lies and games. I was commenting on how it seems that too many Black men view relationships as nothing more than tools to control women and get sex, and how little of themselves they were apparently willing to put into their relationships and marriages. At the same time, these men are demanding total obeisance and “submission” … to be given free reign to “lead” without question.

“Malik” told me that women would have a hard time knowing if a guy was sincere or not, and that men often PRETEND to love. He’s a mature and thoughtful guy, and I appreciate his openness and analysis. As he shared his lifetime observations, I realized his statements indicated that most Black men knowingly and consciously play a role to get a woman, while investing little to no emotion in her or the relationship. Therefore a woman’s reality would be totally manipulated and under his control… she would have no way of knowing if the treatment she received from him is real or nothing but a game; she would also not know if his proclamations of love are true or not.

I still remember that conversation. Though “Malik” was very honest about how Black men think and love and relationships, his words were deeply disturbing. From his description it would appear that almost all Black men are sociopaths that purposefully set Black women up to be their unknowing victims. Can that possibly be true? After all, sociopaths don’t wear a sign or tag, and look completely normal.  However, according to the traits and behaviors which psychologists deem to be those of a sociopath, Malik’s statements appear to be completely on target.

“Malik’s” words rang in my ears and have been the source of much consternation since. More than a year has passed, but I am still not sure what I will do with this information, but I believe it to be an issue worthy of discussing on an upcoming Date Smarter Not Harder! broadcast.

Profile of the Sociopath

This summarizes some of the common features and descriptions of the behavior of sociopaths.

  • Glibness and Superficial Charm
    Words are spoken in a smooth, easy manner. They appear to be quite fluent with language which appeals to women’s auditory nature. Charming and polite, they may come across as too good to be true.
  • Manipulative and Conning
    They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.
  • Grandiose Sense of Self
    Feels entitled to certain things as “their right.”
  • Pathological Lying
    Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests.
  • Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt
    A deep seated rage, which is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.
  • Shallow Emotions
    When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.
  • Incapacity for Love
    They possess a self-centeredness that is unchanging. Sociopaths and psychopaths are skillful in pretending a love for women or simulating parental devotion to their children.
  • Need for Stimulation
    Living on the edge. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal. Promiscuity and gambling are common.
  • Callousness/Lack of Empathy
    Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others’ feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them.
  • Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature
    Rage and abuse, alternating with small expressions of love and approval produce an addictive cycle for abuser and abused, as well as creating hopelessness in the victim. Believe they are all-powerful, all-knowing, entitled to every wish, no sense of personal boundaries, no concern for their impact on others.
  • Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency
    Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet “gets by” by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.
  • Irresponsibility/Unreliability
    Not concerned about wrecking others’ lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blames others, even for acts they obviously committed.
  • Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity
    Promiscuity, child sexual abuse, rape and sexual acting out of all sorts.
  • Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle
    Tends to move around a lot or makes all encompassing promises for the future, poor work ethic but exploits others effectively.
  • Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility
    Changes their image as needed to avoid prosecution. Changes life story readily.

Other Related Qualities:

Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them

Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them

Authoritarian

Secretive

Paranoid

Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired

Conventional appearance

Goal of enslavement of their victim(s)

Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim’s life

Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim’s affirmation (respect, gratitude and love)

Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim

Incapable of real human attachment to another

Unable to feel remorse or guilt

Extreme narcissism and grandiose

May state readily that their goal is to rule the world

They scapegoat and blame. Sociopaths are incapable of either having the insight or willingness to accept responsibility for anything they do. Whatever the problem, it is always the fault of someone else.

 

(The above traits are based on the psychopathy checklists of H. Cleckley and R. Hare.)

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Deborrah

Veteran social researcher, relationship advice columnist, author and radio host. Author of hundreds of articles on American and black culture, gender issues, singles, dating and relationships. Author of "Sucka Free Love!" , "The 24 Types of Suckas to Avoid," and "The Black Church - Where Women Pray and Men Pray" all available on Amazon.Com. Her unique voice and insightful commentary have delighted fans and riled haters for 20 years. Read her stuff on Examiner.Com, SurvivingDating.Com and AskHeartBeat.Com.

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Category: Date Smarter, Not Harder

37 comments
swirlygirl
swirlygirl

Yes I was with two men that displayed all of these character traits. These types of men target women and are highly deceptive. Both men were this type and was able to escape both times. I started researching this subject and it is indeed a phenomenon, occuring especially in the black comunity. I have my 13 year old daughter who I sometimes have read your work. Thank you!

TheAmericanaOya
TheAmericanaOya

oh damn this really turns me off from bm, treating them like shit is starting to sound better

KimberlyJessy
KimberlyJessy

I believe this here, what was written in this article is real talk, and it just "certifies" my belief and my decision to completely move on from EVER mating with, dating, procreating, or marry any one of the Sociopaths, described in this article from the BC. They are not worth it

livingforpeace
livingforpeace

The usual excuses by bm are the women that want thugs. Seriously? What about the women holding out for their black prince/king? my longer post wouldn't post so I will keep it short and sweet. Married the good guy who was exactly as this article stated. His 16 year old daughter suggested I copy/paste this to him! She experiences this him everyday in how he treats all of us that he devastated by his lifestyle of gaming us all. He now labels our daughters with the same ones all black men want to label us with who want to remain the sociopaths they never intend on giving up on. He has destroyed our daughters sports career and stripped our children of the legacy HE promised to build starting with them. Through our facade of mutual dedication to providing the ideal and amazing black family we lived a complete lie. No thug, he was average with an average job driving a car that wasn't fancy,again (in case you bm missed it)not a thug. He worked up to earn a very high income. Yet, I was frugal yet built a home, life and reared children that would be the envy of most men, white or otherwise. I chose lifetime furnishings, although later accused, after exposed for the fake, of being a money whore. No, I had no department store credit cards and never hid purchases in case that is a bm's response on here. I am not fat, ugly in or outwardly, ghetto, neck snapping etc. I don't wear fake hair, nails or stay at the mall....I almost always shopped discount or sale racks but usually was more interested in our families needs. I provided, as my father calls them, "Sunday" meals every day. All from scratch, no fried and mostly organic. I believed in financial responsibility and accountability, I was a woman of faith, I supported many choices he made but attempted to be the voice of reason on the most ridiculous ones. In the end, I was ridiculed, demeaned and devalued to my children to justify chasing white women for validation. His hatred of his female relatives, his self and black women in general was apparent in his daily, hourly and even seemingly every minute hunt for his white and very easy victims. Real1 or whoever came here to defend bm. Not all black women are the reason for these men simply having no moral fiber. I know atheists, I would trust way more than the fake spiritual man I married. Trying to suggest looking in a mirror repossessed(literally and figuratively) because black men can't control their own impulses or again, because the black woman wasn't there to stop them, will no longer work. That tactic is being exposed for what it is. All one has to do is read some of the characteristics of the sociopath above or even narcissism to see what the tactic is. In fact, sexual addiction books I have borrowed from my therapist fathers library suggests that many of the same men have an addictive personality and behavior. Get off of the (figurative)crack bm! I am no saint but I am also not the one who preyed on women, children and sought out any whore who would lick, suck or screw my husband. How you can come on here to blame all of that behavior on the Jerry Springer trash I and many bw AREN'T. Since a fraction of bw compared to the vast amount of Black men who are playas from white to blue to prison collar is likely not comparable, I have to wonder...which collar are you popping? The bw that contribute to the pain of more women and children for the sake of continuing this sick and twisted game....can choose to play...I am so out! I have real children not grown ones to raise. I hope and pray that the women of strong character having black children can fight tooth and nail to create an environment of love, peace and generosity beyond themselves and families. That they will live in health and not exist in the illness bm and their willing partners want to subject the rest of us bm, bw and bc to.

livingforpeace
livingforpeace

This all sounds like my soon to be ex. Real1 talks like the men discussed HAVE to be playas and thugs. My husband is the so called good guy...in public. He played me worse than any dog in the street since a lot of the dogs just call themselves such.

Mine called himself a conservative christian for the sake of locking me and the children down while he played in the next state over while at "work". His day to day goal of impressing his white coworkers with the fact that he was republican and to sound like he was more than a poor ghetto boy from a very depraved childhood of the same type of lack of family values was also helpful with the occasional stray and desperate women, usually white.

I thought I chose the good guy who grew up with a painful experience of having parents that caused him issues that he didn't want to inflict on our children. He had just begun a career and I was going to start one after my licensing but jointly opted to be a one income household. I spent years showing the dept of love you have said SHOULD be important to men above her sexual acuity. When he semi-trucked almost two decades of the facade I was led to believe I lived with incorrigible sexual conquests on a mini Tiger level, it was naturally all my fault.

I MAY have had too many boyfriends coupled with his rage/bitterness with his female family for all of their trifling. While the men exhibited foul and at times serious sexually exploitative and criminal behavior towards women and children as I found out after we married).

He is now trying to convince our daughters that a woman who doesn't whore herself out for her "man" will be treated the same way he treated their mother. This, after years of hiding and lying behind the life of respect that I created at home while he ran the streets chasing anything that said yes.

He seemed so excited that he could "charm" with his grandiose ideas of the money he didn't really have (even with a high salary) his job title, his smooth talking, pictures on the coast his pregnant wife (me)took, or his feigned sensitivity and misrepresented dedication to our daughter and her professional career. One of our daughters was on the cusp of an amazing opportunity to travel the world with both of parents for a sport she would surely have become very successful at. We had recently had a son. In all of this, he is angry...yes, angry or worse, at times, dismissive about the hurt and devastation of this all. He is now labeling our daughters with the same labels he slapped on me in his mind and eventually in my face when I found him out.

Real1, I would love to believe your obvious need to pin this on only the ghetto men while you obviously make every woman a ghetto loving loser. Or worse, a neck snapping, back popping, overweight, bitter and even ugly black woman. My husband has tried that. It would make this simple to explain to my children to tell them that look at your foul ass momma.

Problem is, they more than he, really spent the needed time to know the real me. The gorgeous woman who can turn heads if she tried but went modest to soothe her immature mans insecurities. What was my reward for being that woman? I was frumpy according to him! Now without him, I chose to be ME everyday and heads turn. I am not an attention hog but, me, my style, my spirit, my current clothing, my beauty(inner and outer), the confidence of my children, their beauty and our overall aura is something that he could never capture with all his scheming.

I can only work to build my children to carry the blessing of a good spirit and heart and hope that one day he can heal. One day, all of the black community can choose life and love instead of this death we call life.

eLLe85
eLLe85

Real1--

Dude, you still don't seem to get it. You keep talking about what women are choosing, even as you admit the men you know like your father, are the ones behaving badly. So NO, not "some men need to take accountability for their actions.."---ALL men, especially BLACK men do period. A woman may very well think she is choosing a decent, educated and truthful man because as even you admit--that is what the FOOL IS PORTRAYING himself to be. Do you get it? IF MOST MEN especially BLACK men are followers, then it stands to reason that MOST of them will behave like depraved, lying, cheating, base-level, gutter-ball trash assholes. A real woman (not an immature girl who has internalized her oppression) who first links up with a man--is expecting him to be who he says he is. You want us to trust you and take you for your word, but you wound up being deceitful, lying ass deceptiCONS--so what can women do about that besides get what she can from it and move on and out and away from trifling ass men? Trifiling ass men come in all shapes, sizes and colors, from ALL walks of life. UNTIL MEN CHANGE THEIR TRIFLING BEHAVIOR, things won't change period.

joeclyde
joeclyde

Interesting. How all of the qualities of a social path. Seem to be similar to what most black women are attracted to in Black men.

Swag for days y'all.

Trixie
Trixie

Dang Deborrah....bringing the knowledge again. What is wrong with this picture? It's truly perplexing and heartbreaking.

realbeautifulwomenwearscarves
realbeautifulwomenwearscarves

As a single black woman in her 30's I can honestly agree with this article. I do believe this profile is particular to BM in America and their approach to dating. I don't think they have criminal intentions but they seemingly have no understanding for and/or have no respect for the methods of humanity nor the value of the dignified and emotionally healthy woman.

I came from an immigrant family. I grew up in Atlanta over the last 30 years. I grew up in community, love and culture. Upon joining the American dating scene in my early 20's I was eager and open to the idea of continuing the blueprint of community, love and culture my parents modeled for me, however I was sorely mistaken.

To start, I was socialized with AA people so I felt no danger in dating the men. As time passed, like any girl looking for love, my heart was broken a time or two. I was never arrogant enough to think I was exempt from heart break, however, the manner in which I received it is often the very thing that unnecessarily broke my spirit.

I do find that the dating game requires "hunters" in men. But black men have proven themselves beyond average "hunters" and instead predators. I find their behavior coinciding with cold-blooded robbers and killers of the female fragility, self-esteem spirit and in some cases overall potential. There is something quite peculiar about the BM's inability and/or desire to connect and build for the sake of happiness. I often contemplate if it is an actual inability or is it an apathy towards desire or most worse-just a game.

It is no secret that the history associated with black America typically plays a role in characterizing the social maladjustment of it's people but when is enough enough? We should not need MLKs or President Obamas constantly present for a man to regard a woman (outside his Momma) as a human worthy of dignity and respect whether he has intentions towards her or not.

Dating in black America has become one big anxiety attack for me personally. If and when I do respond to a BM's advances I often find myself paranoid and trying to detect tendencies of a sociopath. Contrarily, when I date other groups I do not. I have other cautionary thoughts but I hardly monitor against manipulation like I do with AA men. I have learned that they set out to charm, then take, only to abandon the situation in the most callous and unmarked fashion . What they unnecessarily leave behind without guilt or remorse is the remains of emotionally disfigured and disillusioned woman. I wish I wasn't so scared of them but I am so I no longer date them.

livingforpeace
livingforpeace

Oh....I forgot how self hating he is. He hates on his children's nappy hair, exclaimed at my sons blond highlights and fair complexion at birth like he won the lottery but I married him knowing well aware that our people has naturally kinky, curly and fabulous hair and that he is the color of Hershey's chocolate! He asked our now natural daughter with his very coarse hair texture, when she was going to perm it again! He always complemented her relaxed and mid back tresses but hates on her curl puffs! I nearly had to threaten his life for him to feign acceptance and now he makes these very transparent(to our daughter) and very shallow compliments that sound worse than ignorant white people about her hair. Oddly and sadly, most white people love her hair more. I guess that is my fault too for his nap genes? While I love and encouraged her to be proud of all of her, he ridicules and shames her about the very genes he passed nearly without my genes showing up. How shallow and very ridiculous. This guy is the classic nice guy that all the bm claim can't get the cute girls...only he did. He was hunting for the ugly ones to hide in the shadows and have me as his front for his own personal depravity parties. Now that I, and many women quit, blame us? No....I value my health more. As we know our community is in denial about sex leading to deadly diseases. Women get blamed for HPV and the likes but are a lot of times the quiet host for disease and death while the woman is saddled with being the guilty one. I have met way too many women that have had and still have one partner or husband their entire sexual lives and have permanent diseases. Marred and diseased for life for women can be a cancer sentence when most men are usually not at nearly the risk. Bw are taking on the weight of the whole black community because bm don't want to have to look in the borrowed mirrors since they don't like to keep their own lest they have to actually deal with the reflection of filth they cast on their women and children. I smile and silently pray for the black families I see together. I grieve for the single mothers and children in this vicious cycle. Besides pray, I am no longer going to be a part of the games to justify the black men that conciously victimize the community, women and children because they are the highly sought after "alpa" male. Only desired as objects to be controlled. Until his unveiling, I would never had commented with so much conviction. Don't mix my experience with your touted bw bitterness. Every part of my experience is valid for review, non-acceptance and exposure for what it is. A Sociopath's destructive choices exposed

Real1
Real1

Why should I be held accountable for what other men have done? I'm not out here lying to women cheating and trying to sleep around. I definitely am held accountable for other men's actions though. When I finally meet a black woman my age, who does appreciate honesty and decency, she's so bitter, and untrusting it's hard to deal with. Also I run into far too many single black women with kids, who completely change what they're looking for because they have realized the true nature of the men they decided to have children with. On top of having children, who they just expect men without children to accept, these women are even more bitter than most, and have tons of emotional baggage. The black men who are deceptive, are smooth talkers, have the "game" and "swag" are being rewarded for what they are. They are the ones getting the women they want. As long as these men are getting what they want they don't care about the damage they've done. Most of the time women know what type of man they're dealing with, I think they're blinded by other things. Honesty and decency definitely aren't high on the priority list for most black women in choosing a man.

We celebrate the whole player lifestyle in black culture. Why aren't women complaining en masse about rappers calling themselves pimps, showing off half naked women in their videos, and bragging about sexual exploits? Instead we're giving these men awards. Why are there large groups of grown black women who go to clubs every weekend, with barely anything on, to dance to music that's mainly about sex. Do they not know that the only reason men go to these clubs is to pick up women and try to take them home? It's hard to meet black women period, anywhere other than clubs or church, (I won't go into what goes on at church) anyway I don't go to either. I'm not condoning what some black men are doing, but these are the black men black women are showing us black men that they want.

Deborrah
Deborrah

Nothing worst than a bitter man that has been repeatedly rejected by the women he wanted. As for the sociopaths, these traits are so common in Black men that 99 out of 100 have them. The one guy that doesn't is married to a White woman. So what does that leave for Black women - SOCIOPATHS. You try to make it sound like its women's fault for choosing them, when there aren't any others to choose. Instead of blaming women, why don't you look in the mirror at yourselves for being sociopaths and change how you behave towards women.

Deborrah
Deborrah

I agree. The socialization of Black men needs to change. The focus with Black men is on "getting over" on women, using women, gaming on women, lying to woman, judging women, cheating on woman, getting the upper hand on women via manipulation or any other means, controlling and abusing women. Such negative behaviors are the cornerstone of Black "manhood." Until they are taught en masse to love, care for and support their women and children, the training of sociopaths will continue.

Trixie
Trixie

I love your point about dating men in other groups. I also have dated men of other groups. While not all of them were great, most of them were. They seemed to be more sincere and marriage-minded. For the ones that weren't great and fit this "sociopath" profile, they ALL hung with black men. Kinda makes you go..."hmmmm, interesting...."

joeclyde
joeclyde

But isn't that the goal of BWE? To make Black women paranoid about Black men and look to White men as saviors? If we are going to be honest about things. BWE are constantly preaching that Black men(all) are out to get you. But if a white guy does something (individual). Then the black woman is at fault for not vetting. It is a hilarious joke.

I'm sure Garcelle Beauvais might have an opinion on this article or maybe Stacey Dash is a better person to ask.

But as par for the course. If Black men aren't brow beaten into agreeing with Deborrah. Then she lashes out in the most Ghetto way. Basically calling Black punks. smh

Maybe she should do a study on bullies, and then look in the mirror.

Razzy
Razzy

Livingforpeace you were married to an abusive man

Trixie
Trixie

Thanks Realbeautifulwomenwearscarves! I could give you a virtual high-five for many of your comments as well. They are spot-on.

We seem to be living a similar experience.

Trixie
Trixie

Real....you sound like a decent brother. However, I suspect that you may be going after women that attract this type of drama or rather --this type of black man. Those women are probably great looking, good bodies, etc... Duh! Those are the women most men want. But, in exchange for that you ones with issues. That's what happens when you "pick with your dick". Not saying it's right, it's just the way it is.

Now, there are many normal black women looking for men to share their lives with. We're out here. Many of us are attractive and sexy, but "too independent" for most black men. Sidebar,I am starting to believe that black men use this title for women like me who won't play the game and be a doormat. Nevertheless, I digress. My point is that maybe you are trying to pull the type of woman that brings with her a bunch of drama. If you are picking these type of women that bring bitterness, drama, and baggage with them, you probably need to assess what "you" are doing and why "you" are attracted to those types. I promise you that we are out here and ready to be with honest, upstanding brothers with confidence and not fake "swag". Put your fishing rods in different ponds and you'll come out with cleaner fish. Good luck....

joeclyde
joeclyde

"You are trying to make it sound like it's the women's fault for choosing them"

Are you serious? Yes. If you choose to date ex-cons. That is your fault.

If you choose to date a married man, and get pregnant. That is your fault.

If you choose to use superficial ignorant characteristics in choosing a male. Car, Height, "Swag". Then you find out he burned you and all of your friends. Yes. That is your fault.

I'm not a Sociopath. I'm also married. To a Black woman.

There is a lot of Bitter on this site. But you sure as hell got the wrong gender.

"Are Black men sociopaths" Ridiculous. I swear. Thank the lord. These women are now running towards White men. I predict the Black Male/Female relations will improve. Once we get rid of the sheep.

realbeautifulwomenwearscarves
realbeautifulwomenwearscarves

Deborrah,

There is nothing worse than these bitter men out here. Bitterness is dangerous because it can lead to self-delusion. These bitter self-deluded men are roaming around in bars, gatherings and on dating sites thinking they are entitled to and owed a prize for being black and unmarried with an OKAY job/status. That's fine BUT They think this mediocre status exempts them from having principles, a conscious, overall enlightenment, morals, and enthusiasm for anything beyond Sunday night football.

They know they are to lazy to and impatient to refine...So what do they do to measure up quickly? They just simply fake it! And we then have the "sociopath" entering at stage left...Instead of performing the labor of spiritual /self evolution these lazy MF's figure out how to trick and trap womens' hearts and minds through games and tom foolery. I resent this deeply. I resent it because it unnecessarily disfigures a crucial part of the joy of living~dating and companionship.

I believe these bitter and/or sociopathic men short change themsleves by taking a big S%#T in the den of hope, which, is typically secured by the love and warmth of women. These Losers use the palette of female emotions as a turf...merely a space for scoping out, hiding, attacking and then vanishing without a trace. To that, I say: predator-save the ego, strategy and self-glorification for the sports field where it belongs, otherwise your cowardice and mis-allocation will bite you in the ass.

How?

Well first and foremost you will undoubtedly be publically or privately UNHAPPY. Also, you will turn up either painfully alone with an STD, or with the woman "of your dreams" who doesn't love you (she just knows she has advantages over you therefore can control and squeeze you like a lemon) or worst of all- living in a vicious cycle of all of the above with women who have also been damaged at the hands of your sociopathic comrades thus, positioned to s*%t on you AGAIN. JUST STOP.

Deb, I'd like to say Your response to JC is accurate. This Sociopath persona is what we non-white, non "good hair" (unless bought) everyday black women are left with... an entire stratification of damaged, scared delusional fools with a (embarrassingly so) falsely inflated sense of self. Since I'm black and I thought I had to choose them in the past I have naturally and naively done so . I do no longer and I'm better for it.

Real1
Real1

I think a lot of black women fall for the man who tells them what they want to hear, the smooth talker. The black women who I've stepped to politely and expressed my interest have never been interested. I can't count the number of black women I've heard say they want a man with "swag." More often than not that "swag" you women desire so much from black men isn't real, it's an act. Being myself and simply talking to black women doesn't work for me or nearly any other black man I know. Why do you think men who are able to attract women are said to have "game"? They treat meeting women, and relationships like a game. When the whole process starts as a lie do you think the guy is going to suddenly switch and turn sincere?

I've done a lot of traveling, and have met wonderful women in other countries, just being myself, who were very interested in me. Even black women in other countries are very different than AA women. To attract AA women I always feel like I have to put on a front.

When black women show with their actions that they want something different from black men, black men will change.

Deborrah
Deborrah

Wow Trixie, that's rather eye opening. :/

zorosmask
zorosmask

@joeclyde Thank you for posting some sanity on this thread. It seems so misguided and mean spirited.  Putting millions of men into a stereotype dragnet is some of the worst offenses against black men who are easily the most preyed upon and denied elements of society.  the decks are stacked against them from birth.  I'm not trying to make excuses for misogynistic behavior.  but this kind of attack on black men from sisters must be hurtful in the extreme.  I'm an Arab woman and generally don't comment on these blog threads, but I came upon this site after my boyfriend found a site entitled "How to Interpret the Behavior of an Arab Man".  It was so offensive and horrible.  I was stunned and my boyfriend said, "you think there isn't shit like this about black men".  So he googled, expecting to find something similar.  Only we thought it would be written by white racists, like the authors of the piece on Arab men.  It was demoralizing to see this thread written by black women because I go through more statistics on black men on a regular basis that I care to share.  whether it's the criminal justice system, the political ploys (war on drugs etc), the constant harassment and suspicion, the shitty educational system that targets them in subtle ways, most of them can't catch a break.  That doesn't mean that you have to be the recipient of his pain, but at least don't promote these god awful stereotypes that only feed the most racist elements of society.

Deborrah
Deborrah

Hardy har har. I don't need to bully anyone. I have a strong opinion and refuse to back down, you males see it as me "brow beating" you. I don't care what you do or think. You seem to forget this is one of 50 million websites on the internet and I'm just one person. You cannot imagine the immensity of the fuck I do not give when it comes to what you men think.

Real1
Real1

I'll admit I've gone after the wrong women on a few occasions, however good looking women with great bodies don't hold a patent on drama and baggage. I've dated all kinds of women though, wouldn't say I pick with my dick, of course I would like to be attracted to the woman I'm with, but, attraction has to do with more than a pretty face and a nice body.

There's nothing wrong with a woman being independent, however in my experience sometimes the women who feel the need to constantly mention that they're so independent, are the ones with the most baggage. Nobody's perfect though maybe I do need to make a conscious effort to meet different types of women.

realbeautifulwomenwearscarves
realbeautifulwomenwearscarves

JC
You are not understanding me. OR~ you are not reading my responses thoroughly. However, I cannot be responsible for your scope of reading. I will say it one last time,

"I believe ALL men of ALL ethnicities have a measure of these negative traits"

What about this statement is murky?? I think I am being clear...I think men are men. Us women are a game for most men..HOWEVER, BM hit BELOW the belt by leaving us feeling as used and abandoned as a corpse. Swag or no Swag It is CALLOUS. I have dated the gamut of black men. I have dated the dope boy, the caller center clerk, the engineer and the doctor AND its all the same. BM (like a sociopath) cannot connect with anyone but themselves and the opportunity at large. There seems to be little to no investment in anything beyond a lil roll in the hay with a curvy woman. That, my friend IS shortsided...in a way that is detrimental to the generations to come. SMH. Sistas are doing great things in this world and I can't understand why a BM is not ELATED to invest in that. I mean really INVEST. STOP USING AND ABUSING OUR pride and our spirits. Stop being greedy, narrow and overly opportunistic. Until we are held with esteem and percieved as fragile and essential to the collective black legacy we will ALL stay socially stunted, hurt and always arguing.

JC, in my opinion sociopath is a description fitting for a person who has no empathy or remorse for attack(s)/harm against another. They seek that person out for the purpose of attack followed by a flee. It is dating in the black community.

This site will help you to see...
http://blackgirlsareeasy.com/2011/11/are-you-being-played.html

And as for swag...BM ogle big Yoruba butts from sistas and coke bottle shapes for the allure ...why can't we have a lil something to keep our attention??

I think you should reread my previous posts.

joeclyde
joeclyde

@Real.

I acknowledge that there are dating predators. But to claim this is specific to Black men. That I will never agree with. That is extremely shortsighted.

It's amazing to me. That Black women aren't recognizing this "new breed" of IR Bigots that target Black women. Black women have made themselves into such a frenzy to date anyone that is not Black. Especially White. That these men. Who seem extremely insecure about Black men. Prey on the weakness of these women. Exploit them. But Black women seem to be willing participants of these sociopaths. Interesting. But I guess respect is thrown out the window when swirling.

Also interesting that you defend "swag" but then complain about these men abusing you. This again proves the 80/20 rule. 80 percent of the dating problems in the Black community are caused by 20 percent of the men. Because Black women don't go after any black man. They want the swagged black man. That other black women want. So It isn't shocking to have one unscrupulous black man. With 15 kids, and passing around STDs. But "ooh girl, he can get it"

Thank you for proving. That there are no victims. Most Black women love Sociopath Black men and White men. So why complain about it?

realbeautifulwomenwearscarves
realbeautifulwomenwearscarves

"I'm not a Sociopath. I'm also married. To a Black woman."

JC-Congratulations but isn't it clear that we MAY not be talking to you? Could you for one moment conceive the possibility that you are an exception to an sad but true rule? Could you conceptualize the possibility that we are speaking of a social pathology specific to BM that does not connote criminal perverse/behavior but does speak to the predatorial ways of alot of single black men. Predators hunt and prey on weaknesses. Our weaknesses include, lack of 3 dimensional male role models growing up,lack of dating blue prints,loneliness,lack of self esteem (due to distorted images of beauty and confidence), and yes-sometimes pure naivete.

Unfortunately, a lot of times BM dating BW play it like a sport with no end time on the game clock. I should not need a playbook full of "game" to date a man...that's RIDICULOUS. Why can't he simply respect the tenants of conducting a "relationship" and not necessarily relate that to a woman wanting to be married to him whether she does or not. Because not all women want to be married. Or they don't want to be married to "you". But we do want successful relationships that provide companionship. That requires the following to be successful.

1. Trust-
lying/misrepresenting to get what YOU need only breaks this fast and can break a woman's spirit
2. Honesty-
leading a woman on is cruel and unusual selfishness, it propagates self- doubt
3. Integrity-
Not being who you say you are after you showed us attention and affection is an emotional trap
4. BENEVOLENCE-
Expecting a woman to give just because you did is low base and classless. Alot of BM want to be rewarded for having a pulse, a penis, and a fade.
5. PUNCTUALITY-
not informing a woman that you are done with her only to feed your stale ego is pathetic. Black people in general have a prob with time frame, but escalating a relationship or severing it in an appropriate and respectable time is crucial.

Together, all 5=RESPECT
Men who do not subscribe to these characteristics whether DATING or married
are are conscience-less, characterless humans who do not deserve an opportunity to even socialize amongst the droves of single and genuine BW out here. They need to be weeded out, berated and then ousted for their destructive behaviors in our dating community. Us women speaking out about our experiences are dismissed/underminded by people like yourself as "bitter." But, So what if it's bitter (which is not always the case)? Does that make it less truthful? Anyone would be bitter if their heart and mind was made to be a pawn in a twisted game of egoism.

And as for "swag"...I am not going to apologize if I like charm and mystery. It's called seduction in my book. The ability to convey the 5 characteristics I stated simultaneously with mystery and charm is not rocket science. Or..is it?

Now, JC I believe ALL men of ALL ethnicities have a measure of these negative tendencies at times during their dating journey, however, a lot of black men are particularly callous in their methods from start to finish...with little to no remorse for the wounded or in some cases the severely emotionally tattered or hardened. For them, it's on to the next one...with little to no introspection or self awareness. Seemingly they cannot extiguish their deviant behavior and evolve their ferocious appetites into socially acceptable dating behavior.

propertyscout
propertyscout

@Deborrah 

Deborrah, their are two types of psychopaths, according to the association of psychological study, Michigan. why do you just focus on one type which is called the Criminal Sociopath? their is also the Subcriminal Sociopath  who is your everyday Priests, Doctor, Politicians.

Trixie
Trixie

Well...I guess I should also add leader to my wish list then. I am not looking for a follower. I'm looking for a man that is confident in the fact that he doesn't HAVE to screw every girl and dog her out because that's what most other black men do. I need someone who can see through the lies of what the media, society, and other brutha's may be preaching to him on how to be a "black" male. I need someone that isn't drinking the kool-aid of misogyny. Thankfully, I am one of those black women that understands her worth and doesn't need to beg a man for his attention. Even if it means I have to put up with lies, deceit, selfishness, abuse,etc.... It's just not that important for me to compromise my standards to be with someone that doesn't share my same values and that is to be a DECENT human being.

Real1
Real1

I'm not saying all black women want thugs or bad boys, not even saying all black women want the same thing. But a lot of black women say they want a normal, educated, truthful black man and end up choosing to be with the complete opposite. I don't see too many black women choosing the type of black men they say they want.

I know a lot of player types, my father was the player type. Marriage couldn't even stop him from lying and cheating. My father and every other player type I know get women by displaying a false sense of confidence, and being completely dishonest about their emotions, they've told me this. Yeah attractiveness has a lot to do with being able to meet women but I know plenty of guys who women say are attractive who are unable to meet women.

Yeah I agree Deborrah, black men do put a lot of responsibility of what and who they are on women. That's why people like Jay-z, Lil Wayne, and Rick Ross, who claim to have sold large amounts of drugs and parade women around half naked in videos, are celebrated and emulated in the black community, because young women, and some older women think these guys are cool, and have propped men like this up as the symbol of black manhood.

Yes some black men need to take accountability for their actions, but chances are they probably won't. I don't think most of these men will get the point until they find themselves alone. I hear a lot of black women complaining about black men and saying they want one thing, but choosing the exact opposite.

Trixie
Trixie

"When black women show with their actions that they want something different from black men, black men will change."

I am so sick of black men refusing to be accountable for the bullshit they display and their treatment of black women. If the black women that you stepped to didn't respond, it didn't necessariy mean she wants a thug. What it probably meant is that she didn't want YOUR ass. So, instead of owning up to the fact that she wasn't attracted to YOU, you've managed to lump all of us black women together. Maybe you and your friends are picking the wrong types of women to step to? Or, maybe you've over estimated your value in the dating market? I am a normal sister that appreciates a nice, educated man. NOT a thug, bad boy, or ex-con. Having said that,I am a woman that can appreciate a man that is strong and confident. What about my desires for a normal, truthful black man spells T-H-U-G? Matter of fact, whenever I get the feeling that a man is running game, he gets put in the stupid MF pile. NEXT!!!

Deborrah
Deborrah

And I would bet money that during the course of your life there were dozens of polite young women that were interested in you, but you didn't give them the time of day because they didn't have flash. They didn't wear a lot of makeup or have a big butt or a superb figure, so you ignored them. Well, its the same thing for women with regards to men.

What you guys have to realize is that your politeness doesn't mean anything in the dating game IF A WOMAN IS NOT ATTRACTED TO YOU. Just like men, we want someone that sexually stimulates us. When you are not perceived as sexually exciting to the women you step to, they don't want anything to do with you. And it matters not that you lack game or swag, its that you don't excite THAT woman.

Stay in your envelope. Somewhere in this world there are black women that would be thrilled to be with you. But you have to understand what your Romantic Market Value is then go to the store where you have high value. If that means White or foreign women, then go there. If it means geeky Black women, then go there. But obviously, whatever you are attracted to isn't attracted to you, so that means you need to change your selection criteria.

Black men always want to put the responsibility for what and who they are on women. It's like you guys cannot have an original thought or decide for yourselves who you want to be, what kind of man independent of women.

You actually define yourselves based on what women think! It's amazing - these are the same women whose opinions and nature you put down at every opportunity, yet you resent it when those opinions and that nature are not given to you in a manner that makes you feel big, large and in charge.

Like I said in my video, that mentality makes Black men followers, not leaders. You all want to say you are logical decision makers and decisive and superior to females, but it's absolutely not true. You don't lead yourselves, so you are not qualified to lead a female anywhere at any time. Your entire sense of your manhood and your self esteem is based on how much pussy you get and the perception other men have of the woman on your arm. Very little of what Black men do or say is based on positive thoughts and opinions about themselves independent of a female. I think its a very sad lie that I've totally exposed. Black women need to wake up and smell the bullshit and the game.

http://youtu.be/C0uXaOJbcdY

Deborrah
Deborrah

I don't do what YOU think I should, I do what I WANT to do. I SAY what I WANT to say and I do both in the way that meets MY approval and no one else's. I am not here to monitor my behavior with the goal of setting an example for other people's children, that is the job of their parents. Just so we're clear and don't have to have this conversation again.

joeclyde
joeclyde

You are correct. It is your Opinion. Nothing Else.

A person of your stature should be able to express herself. Without reverting to some juvenile language.

How about setting an example for the younger ladies. But that is just my opinion.

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