Why Black Women Put Professional Black Men on ‘NIGNORE’
Men write me frequently to get my take on why Black women complain that they “can’t find a good Black man” or “can’t find a Black man on my level” when they are surrounded by educated, professional Black men. It made me wonder too. Why a guy, with all the outward appearances of a highly desirable catch (college educated, established, an “on point” Black man) would be passed over by women for romance and marriage. Well, I have some answers.
Them men I’ve come across the past couple of years are frustrated and angry at women for rejecting them. Why? Because the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow they thought would be there isn’t. The reward they believed they would get at the completion of their struggles to achieve financial stability, own their own home, become college educated, be a good guy and not dog out women, and establish a viable and legitimate career has not happened.
They made themselves into the man that was the opposite of what women complained about. But somehow they still get rejected by women, even while doing everything they are “supposed to do.” Therefore, the problem must be that women don’t know how to pick a man or recognize the man that is what women claimed to want.
In my latest video (a two part series entitled “Why Black Women Put Professional Black Men on ‘Nignore’), I explain exactly what it is that women are looking for in a romantic, committed relationship. Listening to this video series will provide you with answers and why many of these educated, professional Black women would rather have a less accomplished, undereducated man by their side than you all.
Part 1
Part 2
Deborrah
Veteran social researcher, relationship advice columnist, author and radio host. Author of hundreds of articles on American and black culture, gender issues, singles, dating and relationships. Author of "Sucka Free Love!" , "The 24 Types of Suckas to Avoid," "The Black Church - Where Women Pray and Men Pray," and "Why Vegan is the New Black" all available on Amazon.Com. Her unique voice and insightful commentary have delighted fans and riled haters for 20 years. Read her stuff on SurvivingDating.Com and AskHeartBeat.Com.
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Category: Men's Issues
Greetings all,
I am really disappointed in the negative dialogue between all. If we could communicate and LISTEN (or in in this case pay attention and absorb what we are reading) we might make some head way. This bickering is in reality the heart of what is wrong, we don’t take the time to listen (both sides) we immediately throw up defense mechanisms and prepare for our counter attack without giving much thought to what the other is said hence our problem in relationships. Men we need to listen when the woman tells you what she needs and then do our best to please her, I have learned that when you give the woman what she wants (for the most part) she will respond in like kind. Meaning a woman will normally give as good as she gets. Try this on for size and experiment with it (both men and women), do all you can to please the other and not worry about yourself and observe what happens. It isn’t about right or wrong it is about mutually sharing, getting one another’s back, caring about what they care about, looking only at them everyday. Stop comparing what you have vs. what else is out there, your mate only needs to be a dime (stud) in your eyes. I WAS that guy who was over looked but I learned to be comfortable with me and once I did that I offered what I had, but more importantly I could accept them for whoever, whatever or where ever they were at or was.
Men try just for a minute not thinking about the booty and listen to them for them; get excited about what they are excited about; go sit at the nail salon and don’t rush them and tell them how you like the colors they picked, if she changed her hair do you notice? Compliment them even if it is ridiculous. Make them feel like they are the most special person in the room, and watch what happens. Don’t worry about them just worry about you because the only actions that you are in control of is your own, you aint dey daddy!
Now I know I am going to take some flack from the fellas but that is kay I am a big boy and I have broad shoulders. Webmistress (DC) keep opening the dialogue and thanks for keeping it real, and by the way you don’t have to fight back every time they say something ignorant- peace!
thank you so very much.
These women really need to stop….One of the biggest complaints among successful black women is that they can’t find a man on “their level,” but yet these women go on to think that these successful black men must think they are some how better….Well excuse me because these successful black women were the ones that said men who weren’t educated,who didn’t make this amount of money, etc….were not on her level…which is why successful men stared to become conceited in the first place….If women didn’t place so much value on those things, I doubt men would really care about any of this stuff….
Wise-Son (not so wise) a male in the ‘nignore category ”
“These women really need to stop….One of the biggest complaints among successful black women is that they can’t find a man on “their level,but yet these women go on to think that these successful black men must think they are some how better….”
Nobody said ‘successful black women think they are better. However a woman who is educated, successful in her career, financially independent, is ‘better’ than a woman who isn’t any of those things. Why? Because she is ‘better set up to take care of herself and her family and not depend on someone to do it for her’. Just as a man would be.
Nobody wants to be with a ‘loser’ so your comment about women shouldn’t place value on a man who shows the successful attributes that she has is BS. Men always have to whine about something!
If a woman dates a RayRay down by the carwash with no job and baby mamas, men like you will say, “See that’s why women can’t get anywhere, they’d rather date the loser playa than the ‘nice guy’ who’s finished school and has a job and is successful’.
If the woman wants the successful man who is fiscally responsible/successful educated, men want to whine about women shouldn’t place value on those ‘things’. Your dumb comment about ‘if women wouldn’t place value on these things, then men wouldn’t care about them, just shows your loser mindset.
You must not have any of these things, otherwise you’d be advocating that men and women should attain success in their career/educational/fiscal goals. But there is always ‘some male’ who is going to whine regardless. Usually because he’s been Nignored by a woman he wants because he didn’t meet her standards, and instead wants her to ‘lower her standards’ and accept him. NEXT!
THIS!!!!!! Well stated.
I decided to read most of the written part of the post and some comments before watching the videos. Once I got into the some of the more argumenative comments, I found myself taking the sides of the brothers, but less than halfway through the first video, I was hearing plenty of points that didn’t apply to me(and shouldn’t apply to the other men) such as thinking that I’m the shit and that women should worship the ground I walk on. As I’m still in the process of growing up (19 yr college sophomore), I feel I’ve learned a few of the finer points about love, attention, and actually caring for the woman in the relationship that were stated in the video.
Just wanted to say that and that I agree with the video and I guess more guys need to learn to be more caring, loving, and understanding for their woman.
I like your vids.. sometimes its a hard pill to swallow but I think you made a lot of great points.. There is a sense of entitlement that occurs in men when they get to a place of financial and educational success. Things do start to head south and there ‘s no completion the perfect picture of what life should be like once we’ve “achieved” the frustration does set in.
Maybe its because we were never taught a balanced view of what it means to be mature. Most of us (men and women) are taught to focus only what would bring us material wealth. For us guys “The guy with the fly always gets the girl (even the “good” girls) – the good guy always loses” Its an idea that keeps getting reinforced in many ways – via the media and in experiences growing up. There is a lot of resentment that comes along with that hard work – some of us leap at the chance to get even.
I can only speak from my experiences trying to be the “good guy”.. I DO think a lot of black women put me on “nignore.” Women of other races put me on “nignore” Only after my own personal growth and different approaches to understanding my own experiences I’ve become more well rounded. All of us go through the same relationship struggles no matter what tax bracket. Guys that are accomplished seem to look past them and not learn from them because “we’re supposed to be great” (sarcasm) – Its conditioning because of all he praise we got for hard work and achievement (not an excuse) – Most of us don’t know how to love … Our schooling in that arena was always been “Playing the Game 101” not “How to approach a woman respectfully 101”, “How to understand how a woman thinks 101” .. Admit it most of us still refer to dating from that childish mindset now matter how many degrees are on the wall on your corner office 24th floor .. What does a “Player” he plays a game – Why is it referred to as a game anyways?? but its not to be hard on us brothers.. its just that we need to just start to change the approach the mindset.
It gets harder to reassess yourself as you get older – because at some point it means realizing – You are not your degree, you are not your job title, you are not your financial success … Then what am I ? You’re just a guy still that needs to learn more about love, how to live life and all comes with it.. proper mental, spiritual well being not just the economic aspects. It’s nothing to be ashamed of.
It still can be done and it can be a tough and It still doesn’t guarantee that you’ll meet Ms. Right at least that task is less hassling because you know you and that betters understanding about communication – Your coming from place that’s more whole. At least then you can start looking for a real woman – the dating arena seems less frustrating.
Wishing myself and all the other brothers good luck.
Keep the conversation going.
^^^^^^^5^^^^^^ ********** (Raz is turning back flips) after reading Orion’s post!!! Reading it was actually quite a ‘thrill’! A dude who isn’t afraid to speak the truth and be vulnerable and admit, ‘Hey I still have some work to do’ when it comes to dating and relating to women’. Now that’s sexy because what it tells a woman is that this guy is open, ready willing and now able to grow, learn, give, receive love and be with a woman the right way! AWESOME!!! This is a guy who respects what a woman thinks and needs and is not up here ‘arguing with the woman because his ‘ego needs to be right’. Orion this is the best post I’ve read from a guy in a LOONNG Time!
Best to you Orion! 🙂 And like your namesake the constellation Orion which means ‘hunter’, A successful hunter hones his skills, and brings home the prize. You are at a place where you realize this, and soon (if you haven’t already), you’ll be bringing home your prize. 🙂
To the fellas:
You’re really expending a lot more energy and thought, and taking a lot more abuse over this this than is really warranted.
The thing you have to keep in mind is that throughout her presentation, the writer says “SOME”, and “MANY”, which given how many Bruthas there are in the world, is a pretty insignificant number that this “infomercial” applies to.
The fact is, that what she’s saying DOES apply to SOME bruthas out there. And she’s right. Some bruthas DO have the attitude that she speaks of. But trust me, the odds of a professional Black man (even the one’s she speaks of), eventually being in a happy, successful marriage, are more likely than similarly situated Black woman. Afterall, it’s the professional sistahs who are complaining the loudest about not being able to find a mate. For proof, Google “Professional Black Women and Marriage Rates”. Further, based on my anectdotal observation, every brother I went to college and pledged with, is married. So obviously, plenty of Black professional bruthas are not being “nignored” (LOL…clever and funny!).
The funny thing is, every negative trait being attributed to the “nignored” bruthas, has it’s counterpart with “bissed” (:::wink:::) professional sistahs. Bruthas too “superior”? Superior sistahs. Entitled Bruthas? Entitled sistahs. Patriarchal Bruthas? Sitahs who feel THEY should be running thangs, because of the size of their 401K. But again, in the Brutha’s case, he is STILL more likely to find that relationship he’s looking for. So really, those bruthas shouldn’t even stress about it. If you like who you are, do you! Disclaimer for the dense: I’m only speaking of those bruthas and sistahs who actually WANT to be married.
Now, in my humble opinion, thanks for asking. 😉 I believe the issue basically comes down to one’s “attraction quotient”. In effect, men and women get points for certain attributes they bring to the table. ie. looks, personality, education, job etc. The problem is, too many of the bruthas being spoke of here, really DO feel that their external accoutrements (car, house, wad, etc.) should trump all else. And so do the same sistahs. Whereas in reality, the “bling” only provides a slight “bump”, if that, when dealing with people on, or nearly on the same level.
Simply put, these bruthas (and sistahs) are trying to date above their attraction quotient. All your accomplishments do, is get you in the same room with these men and women. After that, you sink or swim on the basis of your merits.
So, in other words, these men need to realize that in a room full of “tens”, “bling” won’t make them that are “fives”, into “tens”, and adjust their expectations accordingly. But again, if it’s GOING to happen, it’s the brutha who’s more likely going to pull off “dating above his head”, in SPITE of his shortcomings. He merely needs to be more patient…Or, do what he gotta do. LOL. I don’t want to hear no stupid “Only Black women want Black men for who they are, while er’body else only wants them fo dey money” nonsense”, so I’ll leave it at that. 😉
I edited out your bullshit condescending comments dude. You are lucky I didn’t delete the whole thing. Flaming and attacks on me or any of the other posters is not allowed on this site. Stick to the topic and avoid the nonsense. Everyone should review the Comment Guidelines and familiarize yourself with the rules of posting comments on this website.
As for your opinions about women, no, you men are not more likely to find a woman. There are millions of single black men just like there are millions of single black women. Many in their 30s and 40s complain a lot about not being able to find a woman, being rejected by women, that women don’t want them. So if your frat brothers got married, good for them. There are many women just out of college that are married as well. Let’s see what happens when their wives get sick of them and get a divorce. How quickly are they going to be able to get a second wife paying child support up the ying yang. Black men are not wanted for your money generally because you don’t HAVE ANY. The ones with the ducats are the white boys. So if a black woman wanted a man just for his money, she would not waste time on a brotha, she would go right where the big bucks are.
Lastly, you did say one thing right – that these professional geeky men are trying to get women out of their league. They are trying to get the dime women that have their pick of men, and they are not picking geeks. They want a man that is as hot and fine and sexy as they are. If the geek guys went after the geek girls they would be married easily and happy and have a family. But since all men are influenced by the media and choose a mate based on those media images, you guys pick women to chase after that you can’t possibly get.
Nubiangent: “Afterall, it’s the professional sistahs who are complaining the loudest about not being able to find a mate. For proof, Google “Professional Black Women and Marriage Rates”. Further, based on my anectdotal observation, every brother I went to college and pledged with, is married. So obviously, plenty of Black professional bruthas are not being “nignored” (LOL…clever and funny!).”
When you can come with ‘professional research that shows marital rates across the board of all racial and socio/economical status and then do a cross examination study of divorce rates of all socio economical status, then that might be credible. Doing a ‘google’ search only shows ‘what is ‘popular’ not what is accurate or even legitimate research. (One would think an educated ‘frat’ guy would know this). Media hypes and skews information for a reason. Brothas howl like hound dogs when media incessantly show them in a negative light. Brothas get tired of being portrayed in the so called ‘media’ as being ‘less than’ when weighed against ‘nonblack men’. When you do a ‘google search’ on ‘white teenaged male crime, I’ll bet you won’t come up with nearly as many searches as you would if you did one on black male teenaged crime (or black male crime). Is that to say there are no white boys breaking the law? Of course not, but we all know that being black, and poor weighs heavily in how you are treated in the eyes of the ‘justice’ system. Justice is mainly for nonblacks’ and those with ‘money/power.
This is the same with how the media ‘hypes’ professional black women. Learn to look behind the propaganda’. Plenty of nonblack women are single, unhappily married, divorced. In fact women initiate the divorce 80% of the time. Your highest divorce rates are amongst nonblack women, but that’s not talked about is it nor is it a popular ‘google search’. You’d have to do an indepth search of professional journals and books, scientific studies, books to find out what is really going on not simply a google search. Especially given the media’s historic bias towards showing anything to do with black folks in a negative light.
And just because someone is ‘married’ doesn’t mean they are ‘happily married’. Longevity in a marriage, doesn’t equate to marital satisfaction of both partners. Just in my experience, I’ve known plenty of unhappily married couples who stay together for reasons that have nothing to do with their love for one another. So try again with the ‘marriage=happiness, or that guys think they have ‘clout’ because some woman deemed to marry them.
This article talks about ‘Single professional black women who put black men on Nignore and the behaviors black men engage in that get them put on nignore. We’re not talking about folks just out of college (who probably dated while in college) and got married. We’re talking about professional educated black women established in their careers, who are holding things down already on their own, and the brothas who approach them hoping for a date, but they don’t bring the personality traits to the table that women find appealing. They rest on their ‘accomplishments’ but don’t put any thought to the ‘inner person and what it takes to appeal to women and make them happy.
Also Nubiangent, this is not your blog and the anecdotal experiences you’ve mentioned, you and your frat brothas are limited to is just that ‘your anecdotal experiences’. This doesn’t make ‘your experiences, hold true for hundreds of thousands of other people. In reading Ms. Cooper’s bio, she’s been doing this for 20 years and has interacted with thousands of people in dating and relationship from around the world so she knows over a much broader audience than you and ‘your limited anecdotal experience’.
Rather than come here and try to ‘boss’ what she says and how she says it, you can always go away and write your own blog, rather than coming here and taking up for your ‘bros the SilentBro, Danta’s and others who come on the blog; all of whom rather than learn something, they are defensive, whine and complain about what women are doing wrong. And you’re starting to do the same.
This article is Why black Women put Professional black men on Nignore’ It is not about why black men ignore women, or any of the other things you and ‘your ‘bros’ are trying to flip it off to be. If you want to talk about something else, then write your own article.
Otherwise, though you’ve made some valid points, in your post, you’ve mostly ‘whined and complained (albeit most eloquently) and gotten mad that an article like this was written and that women are ‘talking about these behaviors that brothas have expected women to shut up and deal with because of ‘black male privilege. Like so many other brothas, you don’t like it when you’re criticized by a woman. You think you’re beyond reproach.
Bottom line, nobody cares what you think really and this ain’t your blog. If you don’t like what is being posted, SCRAM!
Whew…Sisters and Brothers, I have read all of these arguments posed by both sides. All I see is white society sitting in judgment watching these points put forth by both sides and laughing at us. The letter that was compose oh so many years ago is still has us in its grips, “You must use the female VS the male, and the male VS, the female”, it goes on to state, “and the good thing about this plan is that if used intensely for one year the slave will remain perpetually distrustful”. This letter was allegedly written in 1772, I can confirm or deny the letter; however I can say it seems to be the blue print for keeping black females and males apart.
As a 45 year old man I can hear our ancestors turning over in their graves and crying out “is this what I gave my life for”. Lack of understanding on both sides….we have all been wounded to the point that we have started talking at each other instead of to each other…Our rate of success as a collective of people is at an all time low…brothers going to jail at alarming rates sisters having baby after baby for pooky, Ray Ray and everybody else…both sides not realizing we are being used as cannon fodder for the rest of the world…Brothers we who have worked hard to achieve what we have deserve a round of applause, however we cannot rise to true success without the sisters by our side and she should be recognized for being the steadfast woman she is also… A man cannot be a man unless he has a woman to be a man for…A woman cannot achieve true womanhood unless she has a man to be a woman for…The greatest thing a man can be on this earth is a husband and father…The greatest thing a woman can be on this earth is a wife and mother, every thing both men and women do in life is to make you better at being those two things. We forget how families struggled to stay together during difficult times in our history, now we have to read books and go to seminars to do the most rudimentary thing in human existence, a male/ female relationship.
White women practice the lessons taught in finishing school which is occasionally used in American parlance to refer to certain small women’s colleges, primarily on the East Coast, that are known for serving to prepare their female students for marriage. Why marriage? Families are the foundation of a strong community? The power elite know that, that is why you seldom see a true power broker who is single and wants to stay that way.
Who taught the sisters what to look for in a man? Brothers who taught you how to be a man?
Do to lack of strong male role models young men are growing up in households where Lil Wayne, TI and other Hip celebrities have become surrogate fathers to them, many have no clue as to who Marcus Garvey, Elijah Muhammad, Booker T. Washington, Martin L. King, Paul Roberson, and Cheikh Anta Diop are, nor do they care. These prominent black men had a heavy impact on the African American community because men took heed to the ideals and used them to build a sense of community, and strong families that valued hard work ethic and morality. This included placing great value on the sisters in their life as any real man would. Real men desire women like Fannie Lou Hamer, Lena Horne, Ruby Dee, Michelle O’bama and other sisters of great character. Without a dought each sister has within her the ability to achieve great things, we know that the black woman does not need a man to take care of her financially, she can do that herself. She can raise a child to adulthood alone and she does. You can drive a car with your feet but does that mean you should do it. I’m by no means saying the black woman should be anyone’s door mate however I am saying take inventory of the choices that you make both sexes. We are in crisis, especially the sisters, Yale researchers Natalie Nitsche and Hannah Brueckner argued that “marriage chances for highly educated black women have declined over time….” Women with postgraduate educations “face particularly hard choices between career and motherhood,” they said, “but especially in the absence of a reliable partner.” the article goes on to state, “most educated, professional women who want to marry can and do marry. But the picture is less bright for high achieving black women because “marriage markets” for them have deteriorated to the point that many remain unmarried, the researchers found. Since these women also feel pressured not to become single mothers, they often go childless as well, the researchers found. I ask you how can we build a strong black community without strong black families?? Therefore we need to address our issues and get to the root of the problem. As I stated before if we don’t live together we are damn sure gonna die together.
The angry Black man and the angry Black woman is real and we should be, but not at each other, not at each other sisters and brother…peace and blessings
Invisibleblkman “As a 45 year old man I can hear our ancestors turning over in their graves and crying out “is this what I gave my life for”
Oh pluueeze, men kill me with this patriarchal mindset they have. As long as women were silent and compliant, they assumed the women were happy with the status quo. Plenty of women from years ago were quite unhappy with the way men set up the world. That is why we had laws in place to correct those who were disenfranchised by laws made ‘by men’ to benefit men. Did you know that up until the mid 80’s a woman was discriminated against because of her ability to get pregnant? PDA Pregnancy discrmination act was put in place to protect women in the work place as were sexual harrassmsent and other laws so give it a rest will ya. Men start howling the minute women start getting enlightened and speaking up about men’s unchallenged idealogies and attitudes that they’ve gotten away with for years. You try walking in the shoes of a woman and see how you would like it. And if you’re a black woman you have to contend with even more discrimination.
“Brothers we who have worked hard to achieve what we have deserve a round of applause, however we cannot rise to true success without the sisters by our side and she should be recognized for being the steadfast woman she is also… A man cannot be a man unless he has a woman to be a man for…A woman cannot achieve true womanhood unless she has a man to be a woman for…The greatest thing a man can be on this earth is a husband and father…The greatest thing a woman can be on this earth is a wife and mother, every thing both men and women do in life is to make you better at being those two things.”
More rhetoric and drivel and canned responses. A man does not need a woman to prop him up in order for him to achieve success and be a man. It’s 2010 now and women are starting to realize that. Opportunities are opening up for women to advance themselves career wise and educational wise and women are stepping up and achieving. All of that time and energy devoted to a man, is going out of the window. Women were restricted by gender roles and closed opportunities in society even 10 years ago. A lot of that is changing. Women are realizing that why put all of their time and energy in a man when they can put it on themselves. Men who are used to being propped up by a woman are being left to fold like a bad poker hand now that they have to stand up on their own sans a ‘woman’s support. She is getting hers, guys who can’t achieve are getting weeded out, left behind to sink to the bottom where they belong.
And that mess about men and women are put on earth to be wife and mother, husband and father is BS in 2010. That is long standing traditional patriarchy talking because that is what men have socialized themselves to think and they’ve socialized women to live in this restrictive role too. This is why women couldn’t achieve because men set up rules in society that discouraged women from being much more than wife and mother. Job opportunities were denied to them. All of that is changing. Men with the traditional mindset you have will be left behind. Women do not derive their definition of womanhood by what some man thinks they ought to be doing which is the ‘wife/mother role. Women can do whatever the heck they wanna do. If they want to be CEO of a hedge fund, then they can. If they want to be ‘child free’ (not every woman wants to birth,raise kids), they can do it. Men who think like you can go kick rocks, because this kind of thinking is what has been holding women back for decades.
“We are in crisis, especially the sisters, Yale researchers Natalie Nitsche and Hannah Brueckner argued that “marriage chances for highly educated black women have declined over time. “most educated, professional women who want to marry can and do marry. But the picture is less bright for high achieving black women because “marriage markets” for them have deteriorated to the point that many remain unmarried, the researchers found.”
Your mistake is again your traditional mindset that all women should desire to be wife and mothers. That is patriarchal mindset. Who wants to get married these days? A woman can still live a fulfilling life, have an enjoyable male companion in her life on ‘her terms’ not his and she doesn’t have to get married to do it. Who wants to be with the same man for years on end watching everything on his body get stiff except the one thing that matters the most, that gets limp hahaha.
I suggest you read Ms. Cooper’s article “The Cons of Marriage – Why Women Should Not Get Married” http://survivingdating.com/?p=1182
And while you’re at it, read her article “Why Women Should Stop Having Children” http://survivingdating.com/?p=1091
You can also read ‘Wifework” by Susan Maushart
Women in 2010 are waking up and realizing that being some man’s wife and mother of his children is not the fairy tale fullfilling dream men have sold women into thinking. Women should devote more time to themselves and ‘what they want to do’ and that doesn’t always mean giving birth and being some man’s wife and all that goes with it, which pretty much means a ‘second job for women since they primarily run the homes and takes care of the children while the ‘men helps out’.
I watched my grandmother work outside the home standing up on her legs at a sewing factory for years. Then she would come home, cook, clean, take care of her grandkids when she had us, while my granddaddy came on and sat in his easy chair and opened up his newspaper. No wonder men are howling like a hound dog nowadays. They don’t like it that women are opening their eyes and ripping the blinders off. Marriage is way more beneficial for men than it ever was for women. My grandmother was the one who told me to get all I can for myself and go as far as I can in life. She said she wished she had the opportunities that I have. For an intelligent successful educated black woman who is holding things down, on her own, what can a man really offer her except sex and she doesn’t need to marry him for that. Times are changing, men like you either change your mindset or get left behind.
Black women have always led the way in change. They are leaders not followers. Harriet Tubman was the leader who led slaves to freedom. Somehow black men expect black women to be June Cleaver when she has never been that way historically in this country.
Girl you STAY putting it down, thank you for addressing his patriarchal comment way better than I could!
Less Edumatcated Black man? FASCINATING. You talke about Women want men That take action, and Decisive and all that, and then totally write and show the opposite on this Blog, and those podcasts. You ain’t makin’ sense! Men and women are supposed to walk with each other not one in front and one behind. You can’t win You want a Brother to be educated but not smart as you or like you, you want a bad boy, but he gotta be sensative to you and your needs It ain’t gonna happen!!!! It just ain’t!!!! You talk about why us Educmacated nice Dudes ain’t gettin’ nowhere with women cuz we ain’t emotional? Please!!!! I like many others we Rational, Logical and make sense. We emotional and we show it when we do things not just to talk about it. And again you talking sex, makin’ your toes curl back and everything and thinking a nice Guy is weak in Bed cuz we ain’t Bad Boys or Thugs. I’mma share alittle secret with You Nice Guys if we want you like you want us will Put it down on you all the time. Part 2 inna minute.
Danta: “You can’t win You want a Brother to be educated but not smart as you or like you, you want a bad boy, but he gotta be sensative to you and your needs It ain’t gonna happen!!!! It just ain’t!!!”
Sigh… Another whiny dude. Man that factory keeps on churning out the so called ‘nice whiny guys’. Is it any wonder sistahs are nignoring them? A man wouldn’t be intimidated by a confident woman who knows what she wants and what she doesn’t want. A man would be taking notes so he can avoid being ‘nignored. Instead the ‘whiny ‘nice guys’ howl, whine and act all defensive. The message they are sending out is not one that is attractive to women at all. Women want men who are willing to learn how to please them and who are open to learning new ideas as relates to women. That’s why the playas have it over the ‘nice whiny guys’. They know how to appeal to women, all you guys know how to do is whine. You want some cheese? Danta, ‘Clean out your ears, and listen to what is actually being said, and not what you’re interpreting is being said. Listening comprehension skills point to the fact that you are indeed an ‘edumuncated male instead of an ‘educated man’.
Part 2.
That’s always what women look over and it’s alot of selfishness out there about what a woman wants. Ain’t a Relatiosnhip based on 2 people? That’s what I thought. Nice dudes will give a woman exactly what she wants if she is honest about what she wants and stop commin’ up with these ridiculous expectations of how you want a man to be. It be amazing to me how women that know dudes ain’t good for them they get with him anyway and Justify everything he does and make excuses all the live long day. Back to the Bad Boy y’all women that like these dudes claim that you want a man to respect you, and be all about you and the ones that will, y’all don’t like! But a Bad boy he will say Yes Ma’am to his Mother, Aunt, Grandmother or any older woman down the street that knew him since he was little But he will call y’all (His woman) Every name under the Sun! But you his woman right?
(Interlude): At Raz Notice you said please and Not pleasure pleasure lasts alot longer than pleasing, and again It ain’t all about you! When you are in a relationship with a Man it’s about Y’all!
what y’all can do for each other, how y’all can make each other happy. Get off of this “What can you do for me Mentality” cuz it doesn’t help anything and it shows how selfish you really are. that’s probably why women like you like the Bad Boys cuz they be selfish like you. Talk mess like you, and ain’t excitin’ like you! And I is Edumacated( I am aware of the Grammar I am using and I can say that) But I don’t throw that or my accomplishments up in everyone’s face like most women do I gotta good job, car, So what? Be proud of your accomplishments but don’t rub it anyone’s face like you better. And I don’t have a problem with gettin’ women at all but they punk out cuz they don’t know how to take me, so they back up and go for the knucklehead. Confident? Please you date Knuckleheads and it’s not player These dudes don’t play sports or Run Major Corporations, that’s a Player. When you use that word it’s Playa Say it right. I don’t whine nor do other nice Guys I didn’t say why in this post so therefore I don’t whine. You ignored and didn’t acknowledge anything of my first Post Whiny dude? Bitter Woman! Also I seen this happen to many times you like these Hood-Dudes,so much what makes them so exciting? Cuz they look like they can’t be tamed? they wear the lastest clothes? and up on the latest songs, and rappers?, dances? they have a Nonchalant attitude? they talk a certain way? with a whole Bunch of Swagger? and in they vocabulary Have a whole bunch of words like Boo, Shawty, I and a healthy diet of Whatevers, and I don’t Give a Fucks? can’t nobody tell them what to do? You gotta be on Crack to believe any of that! Half these dudes that claim they was in the Hood on they Block when they was really in the House! they didn’t see the Hood until they turned 20 years old! Y’all put nice dudes through all types of drama, and the Bad Boy i.e.Thug/Playa always gets a pass and ya’ll will come to him and follow his lead! I seen it happen everything from educated, and Down-to-earth women drive these fools around in they Ride to dangerous parts of the city or let the fool push they ride, to they Boys House to they Baby mommas house, to pick up some weed, and other dumb stuff what’s so exciting about Dudes that Don’t want nothing outta life, that Hurt people, including you?Then again with having no goals this dude is a Professional Moocher You will let him live up in your house that you worked for eat up your food, and run your bills up. But as long as he’s puttin’ it down in the Bedroom it’s Allllllllllllright! And whenever somebody at your job make you mad, or just upset you will Blaast him for not having a Job and to get off your couch the same thing that you So-called Confident, Strong, Sexy Sistas blast nice guys for that have a Job etc. you can’t have it both ways. C’Mon Son!!!!
Part 2 Cont’d
Plus you also talk about these No-Goods being emotionally there for you I ain’t seen it happen cuz it don’t happen!When these Dudes are around you they are always “On”
they put on that front y’all like so much and other stuff from the gear to the swagger. If you saw these dudes when they wasn’t around you, Y’all will kill y’all self! He knows he gotta be like that in order to get you, and y’all goin’ for it Hook, Line, and Sinker! and if you knew that y’all would make better choices when it comes to mates. You like Niggas but NigNore Us? Wow! And then y’all talk about the Sex with these Dudes that he puts it down on you makes your toes curl, and all that. Knowing it be some of the wackest sex you ever had!!!! But since it’s with a Thug It’s Great Right? Plus you say they will protect you Again I ain’t seen it cuz it don’t happen. Without a Gun they ain’t nuthin! You believe that so much, and you’ll end up protecting yourself, but turn around and say he did it. And you think that all nice dudes came from middle-class families and what not when let the Truth be told Many nice dudes Grew up with Ray-Ray, Lonnie, Bookie, Pookie, and Lil’Nuck Nuck and those dudes always tried to punk the nice Dudes in the Hood and when they wouldn’t leave us alone We would Whop they Ass!!!! They ain’t Tough!!! Never was! But they Beat you up Like a Prizefighter, with skill and accuracy but that’s what y’all want right? Nice dudes don’t need to show strength cuz we got it, and show it when necessary as well as emotion when it is in what we are doing and who we are doing it with. You will always give these dudes a pass for growing up in the hood and makin’ fucked up choices that landed them in jail, but never talk about the Nice dude that came up the same way he did and chose not to be a knucklehead. In case you ain’t Figured it Out, I’m from the Hood! Born and raised I’m proud of my roots and Sick and Tired of these Fools Representing it the wrong way. See ladies if you was in the Hood you did something, whether you played video games, sports, dance groups, mentoring whatever you did something! The Knuckleheads y’all love so much cuz they represent the hood was just there! causing trouble some were good athletes and I ain’t talkin’ Basketball,and Football but in other sports but chose to to punk out and do dirt! Respect to all nice dudes that didn’t lose focus, and making a way for themselves don’t change who you are for anybody or anywoman it’s always somewhere out there better that you can grow with, and will love you for who you are. One Final point about the Sex thing and other stuff. If’n you women want that he beat it into submission, I can’t stand up straight sex you claim a Nice Dude can’t do, Date A male Stripper or Better Yet Date a
B-Boy!!!! You know Breakdancers? They have Balance, excellent control of their bodies, and muscles, and do tricks if y’all gonna do it do it the right way otherwise keep hittin’ that Brickwall at 400 miles an hour like you been doing.
and all flash, gear, and dances Flash goes outta style, gear goes outta style, and the “New” Dances go outta style How can he have rhythm when you don’t? Y’all need to be honest about what you want and what you can give Back that up if you can.
Love,
Danta’
Damn Dante, you took up a lot of server space with all of this continued 1 and 2 to say a whole lotta nothing which I didn’t bother to read. got better things to do than read all of this drivel. I skimmed the first paragraph and stopped at the interlude (lol)
Right Raz, Right. Short ain’t necessarily the Truth, all of it is out so you gotz Reply. LOL What you said.
At Raz How would you know that what I wrote was a whole lotta nuthin’ if you didn’t bother to read it? You have to read it to know that right? Contradiction in Terms, again You can’t dispute and you have No Reply.
Raz you bring up some valid points but your delivery is almost attacking. In many of your responses you get personal with your negative description of the person you are responding to. I listened to both clips first before responding to the comments to try to have an understanding of what everyone is talking about. I think the author has some valid points but I think you both confuse to whom you are referring to (I could be wrong).
I think I know of the type of “entitlement” brothas I think you are referring to. The ones that always try to act important handing out business cards and commonly referring to their employed position, degrees, and social networks/groups, their car and where they live. These men define themselves by their accomplished and automatically expect women to submit to them playing their low numbers and unto women’s insecurities about being single.
The male responders to this forum don’t sound anything remotely like them but you seem to refer to them as such. The previous responders all sound very intelligent and articulate their experiences, background and knowledge. They speak about women making bad choices but nothing I read accused you of that so why the hostility? I can acknowledge that men make bad choices the same as I can that women make bad choices its not about one side being all the blame. The men were speaking to a women audience so I believe that they were addressing what women do that isn’t productive from a male perspective.
In response it seems that some are trying to justify women being with the opposite, the thugs and low life who are no more the solution than the entitlements. Our overly high percentage of single headed households, poverty, crime and women on assistance attest to the fact that men need to be able to take care of what they produce hence why would women be with a man who can’t (nor won’t) provide for what she brings forth out of their relationship…kids?
Now I will like to say that I could have missread someones comments, the videos and my knowledge is infalliable (don’t know everything) but I will get personal and state that my background is 4 generations DEEP in loving, committed and LASTING marriages on both sides of my parents who themselves are still happily married. My mother was strong enough to be at the lunch counter sit ins demonstrations during the 60’s when the other backed out but I have never once seen/heard her disrespect my father.
My father was a military officer (few blacks) who had to stand ground during the riots of the 60’s here and later was a school administrator in the worst neighborhoods but never hear him utter a negative comment about my mother. Their roles crossed each other, although they both had advanced degrees and worked middle class jobs my father sometimes cooked and my mother did home repairs/upgrades. They never said I do this and you do that, they didn’t have a long list of expectations, they both did whatever was needed without complaint.
I read the bickering on this forum and it shows the widening gulf between black men and women nowadays. My only sibling and I are happily married but that happiness comes through continual work and sacrifices and change not hard line list or rigid expectations. This is my perspective and my background, I challenge those who disagree to take a minute to reflect on their own background, current situation and source of knowledge.
Silent bro: “The male responders to this forum don’t sound anything remotely like them but you seem to refer to them as such. The previous responders all sound very intelligent and articulate their experiences, background and knowledge. They speak about women making bad choices”
I think you should make like your moniker and ‘ Be silent’. Bros always jumping to defend other bro’s regardless of what is said. Same mentality, Bro’s before Ho’s (rolls eyes)
Raz you are articulate but what you are spewing is mainly anti man venom. Some man that you really cared about really hurt you in your past, it shows in your writings, its so evident.
Don’t fret because it is such a common mental/social attribute in our community. Mother has sex with real loser, woman raises child talking negative about loser she slept with. Woman is so negative no one elses marries her. Child grows up hating loser father but ends up chasing younger losers eventually making the same mistake as her mother. Now we have 3-4 generations of single woman/parents who can’t close their legs (to losers) to break the cycle.
I hope one day you can stop hating and learn to love yourself and maybe one day someone else will be able to love you. Until then have fun with the thugs and your last sentence is so applicable.
SilentBro: “Raz you are articulate but what you are spewing is mainly anti man venom. Some man that you really cared about really hurt you in your past, it shows in your writings, its so evident.”
Spare me your pseudo psycho babble. Guys always think when a woman speaks up about guys in a terse no nonsense manner, she’s anti-male and emotionally broken. Guys want women to mollycoddle them and when a woman gives it to them straight, in a way they don’t want to ‘hear’, then she’s got to be ‘hurt’ and broken down emotionally (rolls eyes). That’s your ego talking dude. By that logic, then all of these men put on ‘nignore’ by the women they want must be broken emotionally, since these women are rejecting them. lol. So whenever a guy like you starts in with this type of BS talk, then you must be broken down emotionally, insecure with a fragile ego since you figure a woman has to be ‘hurt’ to tell a guy like it is. Give me a break. I’m happily involved in a loving relationship with a great guy and have left more than my share of ‘nignored’ men in the dust. You know nothing about me. Guys like you think that only the men are the ones who ‘break hearts, not so. Ridiculous! Now Silent Bro can you please BeSilent LOL
The WIllie Lynch letter is an internet based hoax. It began floating around in the early 1990s and Black folks are still just now reading it and all impressed by some college frat boy joke. It is not realistic and should never be used as the basis for an argument on Black culture. It is faulty and silly. The main thing is that Black men need to stop being intimidated by highly educated Black women and acting like cave men. Grow the hell up! There is no excuse for dumb biscuit making broads with nothing intelligent to talk about to be chosen as wives and have the responsibility for creating the next generation of Black Americans. What can they possibly teach children? What leg up on Whites can these types of females provide their offspring? Men need to hear the message to choose higher levels of women as well. And if you men don’t view a woman as good enough to be the potential mother of your children, you should not have sex with her. Ever. Period.
Your commentary is weak and retrograde patriarhy. Get real. To reference the so-called Willie Lynch letter is utterly ridicolous, considering its fallacity but it doesn’t surprise me. Intellectual sloth abounds in 2010.
Very Entertaining,
Backwards as all Get out but very entertaining. Continue to Divide and Conquer.
Thanks for your post. It’s hard to find a sensible argument made on this topic. Pushes alot of emotional buttons.
We professional Black men should look at these YouTube spots as an opportunity to see how successful, African-American women are thinking.
It is fruitless to criticize their perspectives because their perspectives are the sum of their own experiences. Therefore, they do not have to be justified or meet our objective (or subjective) standard of validity.
What we, as professional Black men, should do is accept that we are not a desired group by the sistas and focus instead on using what we have attained to help folks and improve our communities. Use your education to tutor kids who’s parent(s) can’t afford tutoring. Use your professional connections to get a young brotha a job. Mentor a young man who needs a stable male in his life.
If we’re not wanted, then complaining about it certainly won’t help. Get past it, enjoy your accomplishments, live life to the fullest, and help as many people as you can along the way. . .
I agree, but if we are not desired by Sistas who should we date or marry… The answer is rhetorical.
Bigjo “I agree, but if we are not desired by Sistas who should we date or marry… The answer is rhetorical.”
You should date and marry other men like yourself. No woman regardless of her race wants to date or marry a man who lacks basic listening comprehension skills. Your comment proves you lack this skillset. This video didn’t say anything at all about sisters do not desire black men. But since that’s what you got out of it, perhaps you should go back to primary school and learn to ‘listen’. This is one of those ‘nignore’ behaviors sistas get tired of dealing with so called professional brothers. Any woman would.
Raz why are you so angry? I see you are very concerned about patriarchy and you say that not all women want to be married. This is true, not all women (or men) should be married and they have the right to opt out of marriage. They also have the right to be treated fairly and equally in this society. But mariage does not equal oppression; women and men can be fulfilled in marriage; successful marriages in a community is a stability indicator. Are you a lesbian?
Bigjo “Raz why are you so angry? Are you a lesbian?”
Bigjo why are you so obtuse and defensive to the woman’s viewpoints on this topic of
‘Why black women put professional black men on ‘nignore? Are you gay? Downlow?
Bigjo “I see you are very concerned about patriarchy”
You know women who have opened their eyes are angry all over the world at male privilege and what men have enjoyed in a world where rules are set up by men for men. In the same way that black folks grew sick and tired of living in a white world where white men set up the rules for white men and oppressed others, these ‘others’ include, non Euro men, and women. Because of this anger, ‘others’ held rallies, organized groups and started a movement. You may have heard of them, Black panthers, Civil Rights Movement, Malcom X etc… Only a man who has never walked in the shoes of a woman and had to deal with what women deal with on a day to day basis can be dismissive of her concerns, can state just like you that ‘here is just another woman who ‘must be a lesbian. (rolls eyes). Why can’t a woman be angry because she ‘has just cause, once she realizes that men (including black men) have enjoyed male privileges at the expense of ‘her happiness’.
Only a man has the luxury of overlooking what women go through living in a patriarchal world and the impact it has had on her livlihood and this includes opportunities denied to her, roles she is restricted into doing, and what she is expected to do in marriage. Go read a few books on gender roles Bigio, go dress in drag as a black woman for say a year (so that you really look like a woman), live like a black woman, then come back and talk to me about being angry. Women, can get sick and tired of male patriarchy (especially from black men because brothas are some of the most traditional minded black men on the planet, besides middle eastern men), just as black men are sick and tired of racism and the impact it has on their lives. Is a brotha a racist because he is angry at the ‘man’ when he realizes what the ‘white man’s privileges mean for him? Well then, that doesn’t mean a woman has to be a lesbian when she realizes what black men’s attitudes and male privileges has meant to her and the negative impact it has on her lives. I love ‘Men‘ who know how to treat women well in the ways that matter to women’. But I dislike stupid ‘males’, who think because they are ‘males’ with testicles, this entitles them to certain privileges, while disempowering women. ‘Males’ who act ‘entitled’ to women and that women are supposed to put them on a pedestal because they are ‘professional men’ and they expect that a women’s place in life is to ‘serve, support and uplift him, meanwhile it isn’t reciprocal.
Bigjo: “But mariage does not equal oppression; women and men can be fulfilled in marriage; successful marriages in a community is a stability indicator”
In the institution of marriage, women do 95% of the work that goes into maintaining a marriage day to day, while men ‘help out’, this includes child-rearing, running the home etc.. even though both hold jobs outside of the home, that woman is expected to start her ‘second shift’ of work once she gets done with her outside job. All of this is socialization set up by men dictating what a woman’s roles should be. I say men who think like that can kick rocks. I’d rather have a man, who is right there with me starting the second shift together. A man who ‘shows‘ emotional support, rolling up his sleeve and taking equal parts in running a household.
Men like you often ‘talk‘ about what ‘can and should be‘ in a marriage, without facing the reality that it ain’t actually happening. Look at the high divorce rate stats all across racial socio-economic lines. This marriage thang ain’t working out to well long term for folks. Women are the ones filing for the divorce nearly 80% of the time as they wake up and realize that marriage is not as fulfilling as they once thought it was. I have a friend right now dealing with deciding whether to leave her hubby of less than 3 years. The guy was one way during courtship, soon as the ‘I-Do’s’ were said, he changed and not for the better. As more and more women are waking up, they are realizing they can lead a fulfilling life sans marriage. They can still enjoy the company of men on ‘their terms’. Men like to think that they are the only ones who get to dictate terms in a relationship’, they only think this because women have ‘allowed’ them to have that power. I advocate for women to take back the power they’ve always had. Don’t allow themselves to become entrapped by a guy who will have unlimited power over them, which is what marriage does.
Bigjo: “successful marriages in a community is a stability indicator”“
Who gets to determine what ‘a successful marriage looks like and feels like? The man or the woman? What are the indicators? As long as the woman is quiet, keeping things running smoothly in the home and all is right with the man’s world at home, everything is successful huh? Meanwhile the woman is popping pills, drinking alcohol, praying on her knees at night, crying on her friends shoulders all to keep peace in her own home, while the husband floats in oblivion because all ‘looks well to outsiders’ that his marriage is a success and he never sees the ‘stress and toil it takes on his wife because she keeps it from him. He figures his marriage is successful because they’ve been together for years and years.
I say women should live as independently of men as they can. Women can do this in 2010. Women have just been socialized by men’ to think they can’t have a life without a man. But that is untrue.
A successful woman on her own can have a fulfilling life with a man playing a very small part, that of a sexual part and nurturing emotionally supportive part, when the need arises, beyond that, men are pretty useless for a woman who has her act together on a day to day basis. Why limit herself to one guy for the rest of her life? I say be a serial monogamist. That way when she gets tired of that one guy, she can kick him out and get another one. That’s the way to go for women it’s 2010!
Raz, it seems almost like you have an us vs. them mentality. The fact that I’m proud of my accomplishments, doesn’t mean I want to see black women fail, or am for the disempowerment of black women. I have no problem with black women being proud of their accomplishments, I think black men and women should be trying to help uplift eachother. Just because dating black women has been frustrating for me, doesn’t mean that I want to exclusively date non-black women or that I put non-black women on a pedistsal. Even though non-black women seem to be more interested in me than sistas, there’s a whole new set of problems to deal with when dating non-black women.
Not all black men are traditionally minded when it comes to marriage. Marriage is a man-made institution, I personally believe that I don’t need marriage, to validate my relationship with a woman, nor should a woman need marriage to validate her relationship with a man. I agree with a lot of the points these videos, and the articles on this site are making.
I’m confused about what it is that black women actually want. Do black women even know what they want relationship-wise? These videos claim that black women want a man who is loving, compassionate, attentive etc… other articles on this site say that black women want a man who has some sort of primal manliness. I agree that I can’t expect the fact that I’m educated and gainfully employed to be enough to satisfy a woman in a relationship, and yes I agree I do need to bring more to the table than those qualities, however at a certain point all of these demands women make start to sound redicoulus. I’m all for improving myself as a man, however I’m not going to cater to all these rediculous demands from black women. There are some things women are justified in asking for, but sometimes it seems like black women just have unrealistic expectations, it seems to me that black women will complain no matter what I do. Maybe it’s better for me to just stay single and focus on me.
@BlackNarcissus who wrote:
Dude, why do you think it has to be an “either/or” thing with women? Don’t you realize that a woman wants a long term committed relationship with a man that is ALL OF THOSE THINGS! Would you want to settle for a woman that is just sexual but that you can’t take anywhere because she would say stupid things or embarrass you with her ignorance? NO! Would you want a woman that can cook and clean and works hard but who shares nothing of herself so you don’t really know who or what she is, and the sex is mechanical and repetitive? NO!
Well, women don’t want that mess either! A woman wants a man that makes her smile when she thinks of him, that warms her heart when she hears his voice on the phone, that knows where and how to touch her to take her breath away. A woman wants a man that takes care of business so she never has to worry that the lights will be cut off, her car repossessed, her children will have to go without shoes or clothes, or there will be no money for groceries or gas. No woman wants that! Women want a man that meets all of her needs and at least some of her wants so that she can settle into the relationship and know that she has a solid, trustworthy, loving, sexy man to share her life with — ALL OF HER LIFE.
Your defeatist attitude demonstrates that you would rather give up than try. You would rather not take the risk of achieving greatness because you have already convinced yourself that you won’t succeed. You see meeting a woman’s emotional and physical needs as “catering” when in reality you are merely providing your woman, the woman you allegedly love, with what she needs to be happy and see you as her Knight in Shining Armor instead of some jackleg fool.
But hey, if you don’t want to do that and would rather be by yourself because its easier, then do that. To me and all the women reading your post though, it makes you sound weak. Women do not want weak men that give up at the first sign of a challenge.
Black Nar: “Raz, it seems almost like you have an us vs. them mentality.”
Nope don’t even try to ‘assume what is going on in my head, you’ve already proven in your comments that you lack the motivation or the skillset to understand where women are coming from so your assumption just made an ‘ass out of the ‘u and me’ (lol)
Black Nar wrote: “Just because dating black women has been frustrating for me, doesn’t mean that I want to exclusively date non-black women or that I put non-black women on a pedistsal. However at a certain point all of these demands women make start to sound redicoulus. I’m all for improving myself as a man, however I’m not going to cater to all these rediculous demands from black women.
What exactly are you doing and/or not doing that causes dating to be frustrating for you? Have you self reflected, tried to improve yourself instead of blaming and whining about the women being at fault with their ‘demands’? Just reading your comments in this topic turned me off so I can imagine it must be worse in real life. Dude you need a ‘Hitch’ makeover. You’re coming across as whiny cowardly, arrogant (because of your accomplishments) and supercilious. None of those traits things appeal to women. Women want men who show charisma, pizazz, assertive, strong, sexy, attracttive who ‘want to please them. Had you said, ‘I’m going to do what I can to wow the woman I’m interested in, that would come across so much better than you up in here whining about women and what you perceive as their demands. No wonder your dating life is frustrating. Your attitude towards women sucks. I don’t know what you like in person, but if you look like your attitude you’ve well frustration with women will be mostly all you’re going to experience.
Black Nar: “Even though non-black women seem to be more interested in me than sistas, there’s a whole new set of problems to deal with when dating non-black women.”
Black men tend to ‘treat nonblack women better (by default) so this ish you’re talking about with nonblack women liking you better, it could be because your own attitude towards them is different. With black women, you’re whining about demands, but with a nonblack woman saying the same thing, you look at it in a positive light. I’ve seen that many times before. Also even a nonblack women will get tired of your attitude long term. She might be with you initially because of the ‘material things’ you can provide, but you would never have her heart, or make her toes curl, or put a smile on her face when she thinks of you, instead of what you provide for her, because you lack what it takes to get to the heart of a woman and you ain’t interested in learning how.
Black Nar wrote: “I’m confused about what it is that black women actually want. Do black women even know what they want relationship-wise?”
You act all confused and claim not to know what black women want because ‘you don’t want to know’ you’ re not confused. You just want black women to shut up and take whatever trifling behavior you put out and be glad because you’re an accomplished brotha. (rolls eyes) Get over yourself. An accomplished woman regardless of her race doesn’t have to put up with your negative attitude towards her, she’s not impressed by your accomplishments. Heck even someone working the cash register at a store, won’t be impressed by your attitude. Women have a right to know how they want to be treated and they don’t have to settle for what you throw at them just because you think you’re accomplished. Your accomplishments don’t entitle you to treat women like nobodies and to have this superior attitude that you have.
However I encourage you to join a monastery that way you can remain celibate, don’t have to worry about women since you’re so frustrated. Get a vasectomy so you don’t procreate and devote your time to a ‘higher calling. What with all of your proud accomplishments this is right up your alley since you think women aren’t worthy, join a monestary that should be worthy enough for you. Now enough time and energy wasted on you. We’ve been going back and forth for a minute dealing with your whiny butt on women. Either you get it or you don’t and apparently you don’t so move it alone and go do something else, but stop whining about the same thing over and over again. I’m starting to think you’re just seeking attention from women in cyberspace since that’s probably the only attention you get. Dang, get out and meet someone.
You act like you have tried dating more than a few Black women! Get over yourself! Get outside of your comfort zone and listen to the guidance provided by the video and the articles on this site. Educate yourself about how you can become a better man, the man that provides the missing emotional and psychological connection women seek. If you “professional” men would stop thinking you are all that and realize that a husband needs to provide more than food and shelter, you will understand the value you can have to Black women, and you will be snatched up before you can blink!
“We professional Black men should look at these YouTube spots as an opportunity to see how successful, African-American women are thinking.
It is fruitless to criticize their perspectives because their perspectives are the sum of their own experiences. Therefore, they do not have to be justified or meet our objective (or subjective) standard of validity.”
Exactly Cpe but here is where you went wrong with your next comment
“What we, as professional Black men, should do is accept that we are not a desired group by the sistas”
Nobody ever said that sistas don’t desire professional black men. This video talks about the attitude and behaviors that professional black men show sistas that get them ‘nignored’. Why is that so hard for brothas to get? Why can’t they look at this and reflect that they need to work on those behaviors. Actually no woman would be happy (regardless of her race) dealing with these behaviors and attitudes long term.
But I commend you on what you said about black men using their accomplishments to improve their communities and mentor. That’s excellent, however black men should also do some self reflecting. Pick up a relationship book and learn how to relate to women from an emotional supportive standpoint. Being a better man is an internal process not merely external.
This was Beautiful Too, and I know BigJo Personally.
He has helped kids through college, as well as find jobs for the almost 10 years I’ve known him. I’ve been active in community service as well for years. Shame that most women when they have these gripes of who is desired and not, None of this is mentioned About Men who do for and give back to the community as well as help other communities. One day they’ll get it. Ah well.
It appears that African-American women are doing their own thing for their own reasons these days. The opportunities are there and they are making the most of them. And, they are maximizing those opportunities without regard to how black men will respond to them.
Therefore,
the types of brothas referenced in Ms. Cooper’s YouTube spots should do [should have done] the same. Educate yourself, develop your career, own property because these are progressive pursuits. But do so without regard to how women, of any race, will react to you after you have achieved these things.
Brothas should see Ms. Cooper’s clips-and the comments thereafter-as an opportunity to see how modern Aftrican-American women are thinking. We’re not going to be able to change their perspectives, so, recognize them for what they are.
Additionally, there’s no benefit in complaining about it or attacking the validity of it because a person’s perspective doesn’t have to be valid-it’s their own.
All we can do is accept that we’re not the desired type and use our accomplishments to help some kids and improve our community
use your education to tutor kids who’s parent can’t afford it;
mentor a young man growing up without a father;
use your professional network to get a young brotha a job.
Laslty, to my fellow professional Black men: you can’t be someone you’re not, so, don’t waste the little bit of time we have on this Earth trying. If the sistahs ain’t checking for us, then complaining damn sure ain’t gone change it and neither will trying to comform to something that’s not natural for you. . .shake it off, live your life and use that energy to help some people who need what you have to offer. . .
Cp3 “Laslty, to my fellow professional Black men: you can’t be someone you’re not, so, don’t waste the little bit of time we have on this Earth trying. If the sistahs ain’t checking for us, then complaining damn sure ain’t gone change it and neither will trying to comform to something that’s not natural for you. . .shake it off, live your life and use that energy to help some people who need what you have to offer. . .”
This is hogwash and it sounds like you’re whiny and bitter Cp3 (something men like to accuse women of being all the time). Just like you were once uneducated, jobless, but you picked up a book, learned how to study it, went to college, achieved, got a job achieved success and now you’ve gotten all of those ‘material external things’ that show outwardly you have ‘arrived’, you can devote that same energy and drive to ‘be a better man towards a woman, by fixing the inside. You were not always the man you are today as far as achievement and success are concerned. Just like you worked to achieve and accomplish, you can work on your inside to be the type of man that a woman would desire. Stop being so defensive and whiny about these videos and realize that this is a teaching tool. Don’t do these things that this video is talking about and start reading relationship books on how to be the type of man that women will like and be drawn too. Don’t have this defeatist attitude that you have. Man is it any wonder men like you get put on nignore? Dang!
I was trying to encourage brothas to NOT whine or become bitter at all.
That’s why I wrote that whatever we accomplish it should be because of its inherent value, not because of what it might get us in the way of female attention. In other words, DON’T be bitter because sistas don’t see what you’ve done same way you see it-do it for your own reasons, not to impress.
I also wrote: “there’s no benefit to complaining or attacking the validity” of womens’ perspectives, “complaining damn sure won’t help,” and “shake it off [and] live your life.” In other words, DON’T whine. Instead, we should should focus our energy on making other people’s lives better and their futures more promising.
I also disagree that I represented a defeatist attitude. There would have to be an opponent for me to be defeated and I don’t feel that there is an adversary in this situation. I don’t see this as one versus the other. The bigger issue is that once a black man (be he professional, or not) learns that he is disfavored, then it’s vitally important that he move past the source of that disfavor and focus his efforts where they can make a difference, which is in his community.
Cp3: “I also disagree that I represented a defeatist attitude. Once a black man (be he professional, or not) learns that he is disfavored, then it’s vitally important that he move past the source of that disfavor and focus his efforts where they can make a difference, which is in his community”
Nope still a defeatist attitude. See rather than advocating that men ‘reflect and look within so he can learn how to be a better man to a woman, you advocate for him to give up on women and relationships completely and focus on ‘community. Newsflash: women are part of the ‘community’, and so are men. Men and women make up families, which make up communities. So your so called advice to ‘avoid women’ by focusing on bettering the community rings of bitterness and and anger in disguise. What ever happened to if at first you don’t succeed try again. What you’re implying is that men should give up on ‘black women’ altogether . You’ve missed the point of this video entirely. If you’re engaging in behaviors that put you on ‘nignore, this should be a teaching tool for you to cease those behaviors and perhaps you’d have success with the woman of your choosing. Your attitude is: I’m not going to self reflect, I’m not going to stop doing those annoying behaviors that might put me on nignore. I’m going to keep being me and if a woman nignores me, oh well I’ll focus on my community. Pluueeze, I see through your rhetoric.
WOW, this article was written about Black men like me! But I’m glad you don’t deny our existence. According to many articles & studies, Black women are the least likely women in the country to marry – despite their education, etc. It is amazing to me that Black women have the luxury of turning away successful Black men – it defies all logic, no matter how you justify it.
I also want to point out that Ray-Ray, Tyrone and Lil Man don’t provide Black women with any more intimacy or attention than an educated man, yet the thugs and wannabe gangstas appear far more successful with Black women than the guy who did things right. While some Sistas will house & feed Ray-Ray, they find a successful Black man’s quirks and imperfections unbearable.
I would not suggest that successful Black men spend less time in self development to spend more time giving Black women what they ‘need’ – whatever that is.
My suggestion to other educated & successful Black men is to find women who are interested in what they have to offer. Find women who value your desire to achieve despite the odds as attractive & stimulating.
There are some Sistas who will find your accomplishments attractive, but you may have date women of other races. You may even need to seek women from other countries that appreciate good men; countries like Brazil and the Philippines are good places to look. In any case, find a woman who wants what you’re offering.
Your first erroneous assumption is that every Black woman wants to get married. I keep meeting women (in spite of my article) that tell me they have no interest in getting married, especially to a Black man, due to the attitudes of superiority and control that you all possess. Hmmm.
Secondly, you have no concept of what Ray Ray, Tyrone and Lil man provide. All you know is that you want to put them down because you believe you are better, more, superior. In reality you are not. You may be more educated, but you are not better as far as a woman and a relationship goes because you are not perfect either. They may lack in material offerings and education, your type lacks in the ability to provide time, attention and interest in a woman’s needs. That is why Player types are so successful with women, they understand what women need and give it to them, even if they are giving it to other women at the same time! That is what you brainiac types don’t get.
Since you are not the advice columnist here, your “suggestions” are not important. You will be forced to go over the fence to get some foreign woman. Please don’t think its a pasture of green and loveliness over there. Her family will resent you and still call you a nigga behind your back. They will encourage their daughter to use you for everything she can get. Then she will divorce you and take half. And since she is not Black, the courts will be even more sympathetic to her cause and she will get the world. You will end up living on a park bench and trying to get some change from the very Black women you try to act so haughty to now.
What men like you don’t seem to get is that relationships require that you give. You have not mentioned anything that you will GIVE to a woman to keep her happy. All you are focusing on is what you can get and what women need to do/give for you. Typical selfish asshole Black man. That is why Black women don’t want you types, you are not marriage material … too self centered and not really concerned about meeting a woman’s needs at all. Only a fool would marry a man like you.
I read your response…its pretty typical. I never said ALL Black women wanted to get married, its pretty clear that some are satisfied remaining unmarried although still having babies by losers. Yes I said losers – I know you (and Black women like you) would consider me and other successful Black men as losers but playas, thugs and Ray-Rays are desirable only to Black women – the rest of the world loathes them. One of your themes is that successful Black men don’t know how to give, but I know what playas and losers give – I have sisters, nieces and cousins who cry on my shoulder, get orders of protection and fight those negroes for child support. You may not agree with my suggestions for educated Black men but you still didn’t answer the question on whether or not you’re still single. Giving relationship advice on who is marriage material while not being married is like getting auto advice from someone who’s never owned or done work on a car. I am married and happily so. But you’re right about one thing, few Black women wanted what I had to offer; many actually preferred the losers. So I found a woman who respects my work ethic and education; she happens to be Asian. You said that a woman would be a fool to marry me, but to reiterate, many social scientist are saying that Black women are the least likely to get married – why is that? Are Black men or the church the only reason? Maybe Black women need to look in the mirror as well. Maybe they need to examine their attitudes and choices – maybe they should even examine their justifications for looking past decent men and choosing losers. Just a thought.
Just because a man is not like you does not make him a thug. Believe it or not most men are in the middle on the success scale with few at the pinnacle and a few at the bottom. Most guys are NOT thugs at all, but they may still lag on paying child support, act a fool, beat women, etc. You assume that a professional educated man won’t abuse his wife, won’t flash and try to kill her, won’t stalk and won’t molest children. Well you need to go study some of the information freely available from police departments and the IRS on the income levels of most of the deadbeat dads in this country. They are NOT broke, just shysters.
As for my marital status, its none of your damn business. I don’t have to be a crackhead to know that crack is no good for you, ya know? Likewise I can learn everything there is to know about the crack business and use of it without ever doing it. It’s called having knowledge my brotha. You being married as a male has nothing to do with the socialization of WOMEN and how women are perceived and expected to be by men. So your opinion on marriage and what women expect from it means nothing. Typically, you think because you are happy in your marriage that everyone is.
I’ve found through the years that Black men always treat their foreign brides with much more respect than they ever do women that look like them, so I am not surprised that you found someone that “respects your work ethic and education.” Asian women go after the men with money – they don’t care what you look like or how you act or what you give emotionally, as long as they get paid and taken care of. I’ve seen it hundreds of times right here in the Bay Area with Asian chicks that play that demure role to get weak, insecure about their manhood and desirability Black and White men. They make you all feel like a big cheese with their fake ooohing and ahhing and your ego gets inflated and your head big. That is what you’ve always wanted to feel like, so you marry her. The Asian chicks know the game and play it well.
Black women are the least likely to get married in my book because they are the most knowledgeable about bullshit. If a Black man comes with bullshit, Sistahs are not going to tie their wagon to his. Historically, Black women lead other women in instituting change, acquiring freedoms, and assertiveness. As more and more women around the world realize that marriage really isn’t the “grass is greener” thing they thought it was, they will back away from it in greater numbers. That is already happening because women want the freedom to be who and what they want to be, out from under the thumbs of controlling men. Marriage rates amongst women of ALL races, worldwide, are down. It’s not just Black women dude.
Bigio, what besides ‘work ethic and education’ makes you so special? What women are supposed to turn flips over that? Heck in America Black women have those traits all day long. Nothing special about that? What’s with guys thinking because they have ‘work ethic and education’, they are entitled to be fawned upon as though they’ve accomplished something so awe inspiring like ‘the cure for cancer? So what, you’ve got work ethic and education’.
Why did you think that should entitle you to having a woman of your choice and when that didn’t work out, you run to the Asian woman?
What else did you have to offer a woman besides work ethic and education?
Yeah, black women do have those traits all day (work ethic, education) in fact, black women are graduating college at a much higher rate than black men, also the rate of unemployment for black men is higher than for black women. More than 10% of the black male population is in prison, that’s more than twice that of any other race. I’m sorry, but as a highly educated, employed black male, who grew up in an area where the negative statistics on black males are especially prevalent, I’m very proud of my accomplishments. Does this mean that I think I’m entitled to a black woman, no, you certainly have a good point in saying that a man should have to bring more to the table than education and work ethics. Look at the men black women, even professional black women are choosing to be with though. Black women lead the nation in number of unwed mothers, most of the children born to black women are growing up with an absentee father. Black women are choosing to be with men who will explicitly tell them they’re seeing other women, or have children by other women, black women are choosing to be with ignorant do-nothing black men, and men who refuse to be a father to their children. Are these the loving, attentive, compassionate black men who black women are supposedly choosing to be with? I don’t see it.
BlackNarcissus how do you know what black women are doing? Have you met every black woman? Or only the ones you know about? Why don’t you preface that with black women that you know of instead of making your statements as if you know what every black woman is doing with her dating life. If black women are outnumbering brothas in education and career achievement, then clearly they are on the path to success unlike the underachieving brothas you mentioned. But you have nothing to be ‘extremely proud of BN’. You are comparing yourself to the ‘bottom of the barrel underachievers. Why not compare yourself to ‘achievers like Pres. Obama, Michael Eric Dyson and other highly educated black men who are at the pinnacle of success? See when you look at them, you’re just one more brotha who is doing what he is ‘supposed to do, and that is get his education, get a job and lead a productive, stable responsible life. You get no gold peanuts for doing that. Shoot nonblack men do that all of the time. But because brothas are so used to comparing themselves to N.A.M.’s (nothing ass men), they think if they graduated from college and got a degree, that is on par with finding a cure for cancer. (Plueeze). Not to sistas who are achieving in education and career over brothas (according to stats) 2 to 1
And if an educated successful sista decides she wants to be a single parent, that’s her business. But you seem quick to believe that ALL successful black women since they ‘aint’ choosing you, then they must be choosing RayRay and Pookie down by the carwash. You should read Ms. Cooper’s article ‘Bitch Made “Good Men” In the Dating Pool” http://survivingdating.com/?p=408.
A woman could care less about if a man is ‘highly educated’. The question is, does all of his education make her ‘toes curl’. Does he know how to ‘make a sistah hollar where it counts, does he know how to give her good loving, support, emotional support be there for her, does he have her back. You think your education matters when it comes to the intimacy of a man and a woman and it doesn’t.
Sure you may get married, and get a woman, but for all of your ‘education’, if you can’t satisfy your woman in a primal way’ if you can’t draw your woman to you the way a man should to a woman, she is going to step out on you and get that primal need filled by a man who knows how to take care of her. He may be Pookie or RayJay, or he may not be. Meanwhile you can sit there looking at your degrees being proud of them while your woman (nonblack) is getting her brains screwed out by the man who can make her toes curl. That’s what you educated dudes don’t get. If you’re not meeting a woman’s needs emotionally physically,sexually, then she is with you for “her” convenience and when she gets tired, she will eventually bounce. She may screw you, but she won’t ever love you the way she would love the man who is ‘extra proud of her more so than his ‘degrees’. Women can tell that too.
Men like you don’t get why women are with the Pookies and the RayRays because you ‘lack’ the primal element that draws a woman to you. You may get her because of what you’ve accomplished and your degrees or material possessions, but that is just shallow and she’s there for what she can get out of you. Heaven forbid something happens and you lose all of your ‘accomplishments and material possessions. See how long your nonblack woman will stick around.
Whereas your Pookies and RayRay’s ‘ain’t’ got none of your ‘proud work ethic and material possessions, but they have something that you don’t, they know how to appeal to a woman in a primal way. They know how to make her hollar and her toes curl. Rather than you putting them down, maybe you can learn from them. Then you would really be a BEAST! An educated accomplished man, who knows how to make his woman’s toes curl. Most guys like you though, don’t get that concept. It seems in your quest for your education, you sacrifice the primal masculine part of you that appeals to a woman.
‘I’m sorry, but as a highly educated, employed black male, who grew up in an area where the negative statistics on black males are especially prevalent, I’m very proud of my accomplishments’
The irony is. While you’re bragging and extremely proud of your “accomplishments’. Guys like you will turn right around and run a black sista through the mud if she puffed out her chest and bragged about how proud she was of her educational and career accomplishments. Guys like you would be the first to say:
“Oh well all of your education doesn’t make a man want you. Or you’re not feminine, or sistahs are too stuck up because they think they have everything, therefore they are too picky because they won’t date a guy who isn’t as accomplished as she thinks she is”.
See a sistah can’t win with brothas. They will always find something to pick her apart with. Yet if she were nonblack, of course your reaction would be different. You’d be oh so proud of the nonblack woman’s accomplishments. Brothas have different standards for nonblack women than they do for sistahs. I’ve seen this time and time again. A nonblack woman could have 2 babies by someone else, be a college drop out in a dead end job and to a brotha she is better than sliced bread. His chest is all puffed out because he’s got his nonblack woman hanging on his arm and through her, he feels like he’s somebody. (too sad) that he can’t derive his own sense of satisfaction and self esteem by who he is inside regardless of who he dates.
Tell me Black Narcissus what does your nonblack woman do in comparision to your highly educated self? Is she equally highly educated and accomplished like you are? If she is, then that is an exception to the rule. Most brothas when they date nonblack woman, she is usually the ones that the men of her race wouldn’t want to date themselves. But when sistahs date out, they usually date and marry accomplished nonblack men. I’ve seen this personally many times.
You wrote: “Look at the men black women, even professional black women are choosing to be with though.black women are choosing to be with ignorant do-nothing black men, Are these the loving, attentive, compassionate black men who black women are supposedly choosing to be with? I don’t see it”
I think Ms. Cooper addresses this best in her statement below. Of course you won’t see it BN because you don’t have that ‘primal element that attracts a woman to you in a way that makes her crazy about you, which is why you don’t get women who would pass you over with all of your educational accomplishments.
Educational accomplishments don’t make a woman fantasize about getting you nekked and fuking your brains out. Educational accomplishments don’t make a woman think of you in the middle of the day and send you a text wondering how soon she can see you. Educational accomplishments and work ethic doesn’t make a woman smile for no reason and her heart goes pitter patter when she thinks of you. But this is what guys like you don’t get and the RayJays and Pookies have it by the boatload. You should be learning from them and getting some of what they have instead of turning your nose up at them. (And I’m not talking about the ‘dogging women out part either).
As Ms. Cooper said:
“Bottom line, women (just like men), want a nice stable romantic guy that she trusts implicitly and who takes care of business in the streets and a thug lovin’ give it to me baby freak daddy in the bedroom. Nice guys ain’t knowin how to flip it slap it and smack it down and talk shyt in bed. Nice guys over rate themselves so they can feel superior to other men that have all the women. WHATEVER!
I wrote this articles on this subject:”
(1) Why Nice Guys Suck and Women Don’t Want You! http://survivingdating.com/?p=2065
Hmmmm! Are you assuming that I have nothing else to offer? What do you have to offer??? Lest I remind you that the title of the article is ‘Why Black women put Professional Black men on Nignore’. If Black women are going to ‘Nignore’ professional Black men, then those Black men should seek other options as any sane & logical person would do. Obviously, you agree with the author but I think a Black man who has prepared himself with an education & earning potential has a good foundation for his and his wife’s future – if you think otherwise good luck with Ray-Ray.
Bigjo “Lest I remind you that the title of the article is ‘Why Black women put Professional Black men on Nignore’If Black women are going to ‘Nignore’ professional Black men, then those Black men should seek other options as any sane & logical person would do.”
Black women should ignore your butt because your comments show that you lack listening comprehension skills. You merely read the title and didn’t listen at all to anything the videos had to say. If you did, then you would get that the video is talking about the ‘behavior’s that professional black men engage in that causes them to get ‘nignored one of which you demonstrated which is the inability to actively listen to a woman’s viewpoints without having a dismissive attitude’. It’ s so sad that for all of your so called education, you lack basic listening comprehension and making educational inferences skills. Wow.
Perhaps you should make sure you date someone who is obviously on your ‘level’. Intelligent black women would find you frustrating because you have just shown that you lack the basic skill of ‘listening and comprehending’ what is said to you from a woman’s perspective. Any woman regardless of her race, would get frustrated with a guy who doesn’t know how to listen and understand her view points and is dismissive of what she has to say because it doesn’t fall in line with what ‘he thinks she ought to be saying’. So I see why you would be on Nignore. A sensible woman is wise to do that to you. She’d be saving herself frustration.
We don’t know what you have to offer because professional men tend to rely on bragging about their social standing, educational accomplishments, and job titles. What you stuffed shirt type men don’t understand is that women have their OWN social standing, education and job titles so yours are not impressive. What women are looking for is a man that offers a deep, abiding mental and psychological connection, emotional fulfillment, passion, understanding, romance, support and family structure. Notice how that list is a lot longer than money and education, and they are all immeasurable intangibles that men can’t see and generally don’t understand the value of.
SMH.
I concur with you. We as Black people were taught not to raise our romantic expectations too high. I, as a college educated Black woman with a successful career, would only gravitate towards highly educated and achieving professional men. I WOULD NEVER look at a man with an ordinary job. However, some highly educated and successful Black women are not selective. Their mantra is to date any man and that any man is better than no man.
Just be careful when you are over looking the ordinary ‘job’ guy while being exclusively selective to the highly educated guy, that you realize that the man must be smart in more ways than ‘book sense’. Lots of educated fools out there who are jerks hiding behind their outward success and treat woman really badly.
And I can see the head rolls, finger pointing, etc…why not add “step up to the plate” while you are at it. Dang ladies what happened to growing together!
I didn’t really agree with these videos. I’m a professional black male with multiple degrees who hasn’t been in a relationship in years. I realize that I need to bring something more to the table than material things, and certainly don’t feel that I’m entitled to a professional black woman, just because I have certain things. Yes there are men who feel they’re entitled to women because they reach a certain status in society, but I don’t really think that that’s the reason professional black men are being turned town by professional black women. Seems like professional black women aren’t really in relationships period, hence all the blogs, news specials, internet rants on professional black women not being able to find a “good” man.
I think a lot of professional black women have unrealistic standards that are very hard to fulfill. I don’t think I’m being looked over because I’m not compassionate, attentive, loving etc…. Usually it’s because I’m well under 6′ don’t have model looks or lack something else on these women’s ridiculously long list of standards. Women have told me flat out these are the reasons they don’t want to date me long term. I think proving to women that I’m compassionate, loving, appreciate etc.. is a waste of my time, and will only add to my frustration, that’s clearly not what professional black women want at least in my experience.
I guess I’m ranting too but……..
“I’m well under 6? don’t have model looks or lack something else on these women’s ridiculously long list of standards. Women have told me flat out these are the reasons they don’t want to date me long term. I think proving to women that I’m compassionate, loving, appreciate etc.. is a waste of my time, and will only add to my frustration, that’s clearly not what professional black women want at least in my experience.”
Well add negative cynical attitude to your other ‘attributes and even Will Smith of ‘Hitch’ would turn your butt down as a client. What woman want a loser with a loser negative woman hating attitude. Professional black woman are in relationships. Just because they don’t want to be with you doesn’t mean they are lonely. But typical male, rather than reflect on yourself and improve your attitude and look within to see if there is something about you that you need to work on, you take your bitterness and angry rejected feelings out on black women who have turned you down for a date. (As though you’re entitled to get one with them, just because you want one). Oh well, keep doing you. You’re one less rejected brotha sistah has to deal with. With your attitude she’s better off and you shouldn’t inflict yourself onto a woman.
I agree wholeheartedly with this post. Excuse the ranbling/rant ahead.
It seems that some men think that there is a check box for finances, sex organ, home, & car and if they have these thing of course the woman should play along and give him the keys to her life. I never got why someone would want that type of control anyway, so these kind of guys turn me off immediately.
I am looking for a partner who wants an intelligent and interesting woman and knows how to handle the leadership role- most women I hang around are looking for these guys. For some reason good character, personality, knowledge of self, ability to lead, humility, generosity of spirit, willingness to listen and consider different ideas/ point of view, ability to follow, ability to commit, willingness to commit etc. is not part of the package that they think they should have as well.
I have my own home, car, career etc. What else are they bringing to the table? Oh, and too many men do not get that when a woman has these things it is not a competition. I do not live a lavish life, but I AM comfortable.
What I do not get is why some men do not get that only bringing those previously mentioned things to the table is the minimum that ANY man should have/bring to the table in the first place. I had to tell a guy when he asked me in exasperation what else did I want to “bring me YOU”. He did not get it.
It can be really sad out here. I remain hopeful, but I have plans to live well whether they get it or not
Nikita your comment hit the nail on the head exactly and there is no rambling/rant to excuse.
“For some reason good character, personality, knowledge of self, ability to lead, humility, generosity of spirit, willingness to listen and consider different ideas/ point of view, ability to follow, ability to commit, willingness to commit etc. is not part of the package that they think they should have as well.”
You said a mouthful right here. I guess since men seem to be looking for the ‘Stepford wife ‘type of woman, they think women should be content with the male counterpart. It is sad.
Men go into a relationship for what they can get without even stopping to consider what they can give. They relegate their ‘provider status’ to material things only. But if a sister is ‘on point’ and meeting her own ends in the materialistic stakes, what does a man have to offer her?
Exactly what does an ‘on point’ black woman have to offer an ‘on point’ black man? I detect chauvinism here. I think women aren’t honest about the huge investment they have in patriarchal social structure.
Practice is required for both genders to be good.
“Exactly what does an ‘on point’ black woman have to offer an ‘on point’ black man”
The same thing she wants from an on point man: Love support loyality, emotional connection, caring affection. You know all of the intangible things that men like you don’t get or value because you can’t see it. So just because you don’t see it, you don’t think it is important or it matters until you’re out in the cold needing some love and affection. Women who are on point and meeting their own material needs realize that provider role also encompasses providing emotional support love, care giving and nurturing in a relationship. The smart and wise man is the one who realizes this and provides this to his woman. This makes for a mutually happy relationship.
What I’m seeing is professional women who are ignored by “snobby”, “cold” or “aloof” professional black men don’t see where those black men CAME from. They think once a black guy becomes successful, he gets his ass on his shoulders and starts suddenly ignoring black women. Not true.
Here’s where these guys come from. I, and many non-ghetto black men are living it now: rejected by black women all throughout their dating years, they coped and learned to quit setting themselves up for rejection, and just ignored black women in general. It’s not THEIR fault that they refused to be what black women have been conditioned to find attractive due to a lack of father figures to present a standard to look for in future mates, and rap culture promoting a distorted image of what a black man is supposed be: a media stereotype, the standard black guy walking around with his pants around his ass (a style that tells men in prison that you are gay and offering sexual favors), rapping to himself wherever he goes and gesturing wildly like he has a mental disorder, with dreadlocks in girly pigtails like some homosexual rastafarian?
And yet, because they liked reading something other than a newspaper’s sports section, understood how to wear pants with a belt, had decent grooming, no criminal record, no funky breath, have a respect of women who don’t deserve it because they don’t even respect themselves (the average black women to laugh at a black guy who treats them nicely and consider him to be “weak” and “corny”) and a vocabulary gleaned from knowledge and education and not from hours of rap music, guys like are ridiculed time and time again by those around him. It’s the old “green monkey” syndrome.
Others attack and belittle that which is different. Professional black guys started out as these guys, called “Steve Urkel” (the bumbling, super-smart black inventor/scientist from ABC’s “Family Matters” black sitcom) and treated like crap by women who WANT a man to treat them like crap. They learned to blatantly not care about black women because black women, aside from their own relatives, didn’t care about them. Now we have black women also enjoying success and thinking that their male counterparts are just snobs. That isn’t so.
Bad treatment by the crappy women who make up the majority (for every rare good black women, there are over 50 hoodrats, even if they never even LIVED in the hood) of today’s black society caused them to view all black women like that. When the ONLY black women you’ve been around, no matter where you go act the same, it’s not a hard conclusion to reach, and you need to understand that.
Black women caused them pain, and as childish as you think it is, people avoid that which causes them pain (well, smart ones anyway. I still can’t understand why black women validate the childish behavior and womanizing of the uneducated thugs they chase so persistently in their teens-30’s years…).
Of course, I expect this to be met with the usual “Nigga, you just bitter.” “Y’all need to man up, and quit being so sensitive!” that guys who bring this up usually get from black women. Still, just thought I’d tell you how it is from the guy’s side of the fence.
When males make statements which include such broad, sweeping generalizations, it is interesting to me. First of all because if all the women you meet (or even the majority) are hoodrats or crazy, the problem isn’t THEM its YOU! You are attracted to that type of female! Just admit it! You like something about them, otherwise that is not who you would meet.
For instance, I don’t meet hoodrat men. Never have. Tons of them out there at least 50:1 ratio of crazy, half educated, jailbird, weed smoking, no car having, no job having brothas. But I did not meet them because that is not what I am attracted to.
So when men complain that “all the women I meet are (fill in the blank)” I know that means that is the type of woman that makes your dick hard and that is why you are drawn to see them in a crowd. Just admit it! Then get some therapy. Then you can get past that into something else.
That calm, bespeckled, geeky chick with skinny legs and not much bustline that thinks you are the bomb – you step on her face to get next to LaKinisha who wears booty shorts and shows as much of her body as possible even if she is just going to the grocery store.
Men pick women with their dick. If you didn’t do that, all of you would be happily married with 2.5 children to a woman that loved you. But you pick your woman based on superficial things like how she looks and how big her ass is, then you want to complain that women do the same thing! WHY? Why is it all right for YOU to think of sex with your woman, but its not all right for her to think of sex with her man?
Corny dudes do not make anyone’s pussy wet. That is the reason they get passed over… no sex appeal. You want to blame it on your education, hobbies or how you talk. It’s not that at all. It’s that you present no HEAT. You don’t know how to talk to women. You don’t know how to play with women. You don’t know how to do anything with women that makes them hot.
SMH. Maybe I will set up some seminars for men. Cause yall sure need some help.
Then you complain that these women break your hearts. Oh please!
Deborrah: “SMH. Maybe I will set up some seminars for men. Cause yall sure need some help.”
Yes they do need all the help they can get! And great points. Men complaining about ‘all they meet are (fill in the blank) are really complaining that the women they meet don’t want anything to do with their corny asses. Women want men that turn them on, makes them think about long sensual nights and days in bed. Just like men want women that turn them on. A corny dude who has no charisma, no sex appeal is not going to do that. Instead of whining about it like a he-motional he-bitch, dude needs to learn how to make himself attractive to women. There are plenty of articles on this very blog that address this topic, but dudes don’t want to read for self-improvement, they just want to whine and complain and expect a woman to accept their no-having-sex-appeal-can’t-turn-a-woman-on corny asses.
When they could at least read the articles under men’s issues in this very blog and get a clue. But no, they read then get defensive and whine that they are being attacked (rolls eyes) so who cares if they can’t get a woman, they don’t deserve one.
http://survivingdating.com/why-nice-guys-suck-and-women-dont-want-you
http://survivingdating.com/dating-beyatch-made-men
http://survivingdating.com/how-nice-guys-can-develop-the-player-edge-that-women-love
Deborrah,
Girl Where have I been!?
I loved your comments about how and why these so called elite and professional men cannot get good, strong, loving, career minded educated women. For me it goes back to what you said alot of people have issues and come with alot of damage.
People need to heal and learn to accept that they may not be the mate for that person. What I have found with men is that they feel they are entitled to a woman, once they claim you, you have no other choice but to say yes. It is a sad situation and maturity does play a large role. These brothers that come to women with this attitude of entitlement really causes much stress between the sexes.
Lady keep on preaching to the women and exposing the truth. I also agree that women need to stop listening to these men who profess to be helping women, believe me their is always a motive behind the advice. If nothing else to convince women that we are less and that it is our responsibility to keep everything together this is a trick and a lie of the enemy and of man. Keep up the good work.
Peace Inspire